"He got on his knees and begged, ‘No, Daddy, no,’ and he pulled the trigger,"

[pauldun170]

Dad accused of killing son over sex with tot
Dad reportedly irate upon hearing son had sexual contact with toddler
The Associated Press
updated 9:01 p.m. ET, Wed., Nov . 18, 2009

HIGHLAND PARK, Mich. - A 37-year-old father irate over hearing his 15-year-old son had sexual contact with a 3-year-old girl made the teen strip at gunpoint, marched him to a vacant lot and shot him to death despite pleas from the boy and his mother, a relative said.

Michigan authorities filed a first-degree murder charge Wednesday against Jamar Pinkney Sr. in the shooting death Monday of Jamar Pinkney Jr. in the Detroit enclave of Highland Park.

Defense attorney Corbett O'Meara said prosecutors should consider evidence of the father's state of mind over the sex abuse report.

"If something were to happen that would cause a reasonable person to lose control of himself, that is something the prosecution would have to take into account," O'Meara said outside Highland Park District Court.

Tensions were high in the courtroom Wednesday as the handcuffed suspect was led into the room for the arraignment, which lasted less than a minute.

"No, No, No," one female relative cried before a police officer escorted her out.

‘Hard to deal with’
Judge Brigette Officer entered a not guilty plea for Pinkney, who's also charged with assault, and ordered him jailed without bond until a preliminary examination Dec. 1.

"This is something that's hard to deal with for all the parties concerned, including the police," police Chief Ted Caldwell said afterward. "Highland Park is a small city. These are people who have been members of the community for years."

Caldwell said the sexual misconduct allegation that led to the confrontation wasn't part of the police investigation.

The shooting happened Monday night in a vacant lot in the once-prosperous city of 16,000, where decay, abandonment, fires and demolition have eaten away at many of the sprawling homes. Highland Park recently exited years of state financial oversight.

Visitors built an impromptu memorial at the shooting site. Two votive candles sat amid 10 stuffed animals, including two white teddy bears with red hearts embroidered with, "I love you."

The boy's mother, Lazette Cherry, told the Detroit Free Press that her son told her he had improper sexual contact with the girl.

"I called and told his father. This isn't something you sweep under the rug," she said.

Cherry said the elder Pinkney arrived at the home with a gun, ordered his son to strip and marched him outside despite her protests.

"He got on his knees and begged, ‘No, Daddy, no,’ and he pulled the trigger," Cherry said.

Cherry did not immediately respond to a phone message Wednesday from The Associated Press seeking comment.

Copyright 2009 The Associated Press. All rights reserved. This material may not be published, broadcast, rewritten or redistributed.

URL: http://www.msnbc.msn.com/id/34025056/ns/us_news-crime_and_courts/

[Rider]

Good for him, the kid deserved it. The dad should be a celebrated hero and not a criminal. He'll end up in jail for the rest of his life but a least a kid toucher is not on the streets.

[CasterTroy]

Holy crap....what a position to be in.

That "kid" could never be rehabilitated. I've never seen a "former" child molester :idk: so a part of me agrees with rider….but DAMN…his own SON?!?!?! If it were the 3 yr olds father then HELL YEAH

[Tmall]

Just like putting down a dog...

I hope the father is punished to the full extent of the law. He is not judge, jury and executioner.

[HurricaneHeather]

What a horrific sad story on all accounts. :(

[Kaneman]

Just like putting down a dog...

I hope the father is punished to the full extent of the law. He is not judge, jury and executioner.

He will be.

Rider's response is humorous. For all we know the kid learned that behavior from his obviously crazy father.

[azoomm]

Just like putting down a dog...

I hope the father is punished to the full extent of the law. He is not judge, jury and executioner.

This was my thought.

What a horrible situation.

[z06boy]

The father should be punished I agree ALTHOUGH I can't really blame him for wanting to do it...however you just can't do that and not expect to be prosecuted.

I feel bad for the mother/wife...she's lost her son and husband. I also feel bad for the child and their family.

As far as comparing it to putting down a dog...well that's wrong too in most cases but that's a whole 'nuther can of worms all together.

[Rider]

He will be.

Rider's response is humorous. For all we know the kid learned that behavior from his obviously crazy father.

You really think that if the father was a molester he'd kill his kid for doing the same thing ? I see fail in your logic. Sure maybe the dad was crazy, but if my kid was a molester, I'd be tempted to do the same thing. Unlikely, but I'd give it thought.

[Papa_Complex]

You really think that if the father was a molester he'd kill his kid for doing the same thing ? I see fail in your logic. Sure maybe the dad was crazy, but if my kid was a molester, I'd be tempted to do the same thing. Unlikely, but I'd give it thought.

Statistically speaking, most molesters acquired the behaviour by being molested themselves. It is also common for people to react far more aggressively to behaviour that they see in themselves. That doesn't mean the father is a molester himself, but it bears looking into based on the cumulative experience in such cases.

No one wins in a situation like this. No one is a hero.

[Kaneman]

You really think that if the father was a molester he'd kill his kid for doing the same thing ? I see fail in your logic. Sure maybe the dad was crazy, but if my kid was a molester, I'd be tempted to do the same thing. Unlikely, but I'd give it thought.

Yea absolutely I do. First of all, it takes a certain type of mentality to execute your naked son in front of his mother. We can all talk about how we'd like to kill people that do horrible things, but few people are capable of carrying through with an execution style killing of a stranger, much less a loved one. To me this shows the father has some wires crossed somewhere.

Secondly, it is natural for humans to place the guilt of their own bad deeds onto others. Father molests or touches boy, boy gets older and touches girl, father is overcome with guilt he can not deal with so he places all the blame on the boy. If this were the scenario then it would follow suit that the father was molested as a boy as well. Child molestation is largely a vicious circle.

Its not like there is a big child molester's club (NAMBLA, lol) where they get together and talk about how they like fresh asshole. Most molesters feel great shame over their deeds but for whatever reason feel compelled to keep going. Those that do not are most likely sociopaths, and they make up a very small percentage of the population. A sociopath would not likely have enough emotional capacity to react in the way this father did...because he simply wouldn't care.

[shmike]

Statistically speaking, most molesters acquired the behaviour by being molested themselves. It is also common for people to react far more aggressively to behaviour that they see in themselves. That doesn't mean the father is a molester himself, but it bears looking into based on the cumulative experience in such cases.

No one wins in a situation like this. No one is a hero.

Agreed on all counts.

Molestation is often a power issue.

The fact that the Dad made him strip and them ordered him around before acting raises red flags (power struggles) as well.

[z06boy]

The fact that the Dad made him strip and them ordered him around before acting raises red flags (power struggles) as well.

Sounds like he wanted to humiliate his son like the son did to the 3 year old so he would know how it feels.

Maybe not...just another possibility.

Several of you guys make good points.

What a messed up situation.

[Rider]

Yea absolutely I do. First of all, it takes a certain type of mentality to execute your naked son in front of his mother. We can all talk about how we'd like to kill people that do horrible things, but few people are capable of carrying through with an execution style killing of a stranger, much less a loved one. To me this shows the father has some wires crossed somewhere.

Secondly, it is natural for humans to place the guilt of their own bad deeds onto others. Father molests or touches boy, boy gets older and touches girl, father is overcome with guilt he can not deal with so he places all the blame on the boy. If this were the scenario then it would follow suit that the father was molested as a boy as well. Child molestation is largely a vicious circle.

Its not like there is a big child molester's club (NAMBLA, lol) where they get together and talk about how they like fresh asshole. Most molesters feel great shame over their deeds but for whatever reason feel compelled to keep going. Those that do not are most likely sociopaths, and they make up a very small percentage of the population. A sociopath would not likely have enough emotional capacity to react in the way this father did...because he simply wouldn't care.

I see your point. Like mentioned above, the real loser in this case is the kids mom.

[RACER X]

Wow.

[Papa_Complex]

Agreed on all counts.

Molestation is often a power issue.

The fact that the Dad made him strip and them ordered him around before acting raises red flags (power struggles) as well.

Well noted. Almost all sexually related crimes come down to power, rather than the sex itself.

[Rider]

Well noted. Almost all sexually related crimes come down to power, rather than the sex itself.

See, I've never understood this. I just can't imagine someone needing that much power over someone else.

[Dave]

if i had a child who so badly tarnished my honor id likely do the same thing, id do myself too for failing as a parent however

[azoomm]

Talking about this very story in the Orthodontist office today - most are surprised that the father didn't turn the gun on himself after. That it was a guilt issue [like some saying here].

[Rider]

Talking about this very story in the Orthodontist office today - most are surprised that the father didn't turn the gun on himself after. That it was a guilt issue [like some saying here].

Yeah in thinking about it, it could have been a way for the father to cover up what he might have done to his son years ago.

[Kaneman]

See, I've never understood this. I just can't imagine someone needing that much power over someone else.

Well, were you molested by a trusted adult as a kid?

[z06boy]

Made me think of the ending to the movie "American Beauty" when the tough azz ex military father beat/abused his son because he 'thought' he was gay and then tried to kiss Kevin Spacey himself. :whatwhat: He then took a gun and shot Spacey in the back of the head. Yeah I know...different but this is what it reminded me of.

He was so against his son being gay and then showed signs of it himself.

[Kaneman]

Made me think of the ending to the movie "American Beauty" when the tough azz ex military father beat/abused his son because he 'thought' he was gay and then tried to kiss Kevin Spacey himself. :whatwhat: He then took a gun and shot Spacey in the back of the head. Yeah I know...different but this is what it reminded me of.

He was so against his son being gay and then showed signs of it himself.

Or a gay senator/pastor that rallies against gay marriage by day and sucks cocks by night. Its fairly common behavior.

[z06boy]

Or a gay senator/pastor that rallies against gay marriage by day and sucks cocks by night. Its fairly common behavior.

...or a catholic priest.

[Rider]

Well, were you molested by a trusted adult as a kid?

Yeah if you count my 16yo babysitter when I was 10..... j/k

[Kaneman]

Yeah if you count my 16yo babysitter when I was 10..... j/k

That's pimp.

But you see my point. It is nearly impossible for us to imagine the way a child's brain is rewired after going through such a horrible ordeal

[Rider]

That's pimp.

But you see my point. It is nearly impossible for us to imagine the way a child's brain is rewired after going through such a horrible ordeal

True

[Trip]

Fucked up is all, making the kid get naked throws up all kinds of red flags about the dad. If he would of just shot him instead of playing with the kid, I could see giving some sympathy for the dad, but he lost any credibility of momentary craziness by having the kid strip and fucking with him in front of the mom.

[karl_1052]

Just like putting down a dog...

I hope the father is punished to the full extent of the law. He is not judge, jury and executioner.

plus 1

although, I do have to say this is the most fucked up thing I think I have read in a long time.

[karl_1052]

Good for him, the kid deserved it. The dad should be a celebrated hero and not a criminal. He'll end up in jail for the rest of his life but a least a kid toucher is not on the streets.

Now what if the information about the original incident was fabricated?

[Particle Man]

Now what if the information about the original incident was fabricated?

that's almost what I was expecting (and sort of still am)... that would be totally effed.

[MILK]

Those that do not are most likely sociopaths, and they make up a very small percentage of the population. A sociopath would not likely have enough emotional capacity to react in the way this father did...because he simply wouldn't care.

1 in 25 people are thought to be Sociopaths. 1 in 25 is a scarily large number of people..

[Papa_Complex]

1 in 25 people are thought to be Sociopaths. 1 in 25 is a scarily large number of people..

I think that number may have tripled, or more over the last couple of decades. I'm part of what was commonly referred to as the "me generation", having been born in the '60s. If that's true, then the current batch should be known as the "F you, give me all your stuff, it's mine" generation.

[MILK]

I think that number may have tripled, or more over the last couple of decades. I'm part of what was commonly referred to as the "me generation", having been born in the '60s. If that's true, then the current batch should be known as the "F you, give me all your stuff, it's mine" generation.

My number is pulled from 2005, "The Sociopath Next Door" by Martha Stout, PH.D.

[Papa_Complex]

My number is pulled from 2005, "The Sociopath Next Door" by Martha Stout, PH.D.

Despite when it was published I think that it's a rather conservative estimate, given the number of people I have encountered who are completely egocentric, have no capacity for empathy whatsoever, and love mirrors more than Nietzsche did.

[Kaneman]

1 in 25 people are thought to be Sociopaths. 1 in 25 is a scarily large number of people..

I think narcissism coupled with society's current gravitation toward selfishness often gets confused as sociopathic behavior, but I believe true sociopaths are more rare than 1 in 25.

[Papa_Complex]

I think narcissism coupled with society's current gravitation toward selfishness often gets confused as sociopathic behavior, but I believe true sociopaths are more rare than 1 in 25.

And my belief is that people are narrowing the definition of sociopath, so that they don't fall into it themselves. There is a tendency in the mental health care profession to sub-compartmentalize various larger illness groups, and create definitions for illnesses out of whole cloth, so that they can create their own "syndrome" discovery.

How many people you know, from their mid-teen years on, exhibit the following pathology?

- not learning from experience
- no sense of responsibility
- inability to form meaningful relationships
- inability to control impulses
- lack of moral sense
- chronically antisocial behavior
- no change in behavior after punishment
- emotional immaturity
- lack of guilt
- self-centeredness

The more that I think about it, the more I come to believe that we're currently raising a generation of sociopaths.

[Riceaholic]

And my belief is that people are narrowing the definition of sociopath, so that they don't fall into it themselves. There is a tendency in the mental health care profession to sub-compartmentalize various larger illness groups, and create definitions for illnesses out of whole cloth, so that they can create their own "syndrome" discovery.

How many people you know, from their mid-teen years on, exhibit the following pathology?

- not learning from experience
- no sense of responsibility
- inability to form meaningful relationships
- inability to control impulses
- lack of moral sense
- chronically antisocial behavior
- no change in behavior after punishment
- emotional immaturity
- lack of guilt
- self-centeredness

The more that I think about it, the more I come to believe that we're currently raising a generation of sociopaths.

I agree but the problem is nobody's "raising" them. If you're surrounded by bad behavior, that's all you're gonna know.

[Papa_Complex]

I agree but the problem is nobody's "raising" them. If you're surrounded by bad behavior, that's all you're gonna know.

Raising them in a vacuum is also a parenting choice.

[Tmall]

I disagree that people are a product of their environment. Its a cop out.

A pos is a pos regardless of why. All that matters is that they're a pos.

[Kaneman]

I disagree that people are a product of their environment. Its a cop out.

A pos is a pos regardless of why. All that matters is that they're a pos.

So you don't think being molested has any bearing on a child's mental development, outlook on the world, and behaviors?

[Tmall]

How do you explain first time molesters if its a learned behaviour?

How come not everybody who has had it done to them turn into molesters?


Its because you have a free will. If you didn't enjoy getting molested, the learned behaviour would be to not do it to others.

Cop out/excuse used by lawyers to get their clients a lighter sentence. Its nothing more.

[Kaneman]

How do you explain first time molesters if its a learned behaviour?

Because its a combination of both.

Why bother being a parent if what you do doesn't matter anyway? Free will right?

[Tmall]

Do your parents approve of everything you do? Do you drive the same car your father drives? Wear the same clothes? Same perfume as your mom?

Or did you make those choices despite being in an environment that should have turned you into a carbon copy of your parents?

[Kaneman]

Do your parents approve of everything you do? Do you drive the same car your father drives? Wear the same clothes? Same perfume as your mom?

Or did you make those choices despite being in an environment that should have turned you into a carbon copy of your parents?

I can easily see the influences my father has had on my life. Nobody ever said anything about being a carbon copy, because that's not the way it works. So again, why would anyone even bother raising their kids if it has no bearing on how they will turn out as adults?

[Tmall]

You just said it, influence. Not the reason. The influence.

You made a conscience decision to be more like your father, to respect his rules.

Now, if your father had been abusive to your mother, would that have influenced you? Or would you have been a product of your environment and carried on the abuse?

[Papa_Complex]

You just said it, influence. Not the reason. The influence.

You made a conscience decision to be more like your father, to respect his rules.

Now, if your father had been abusive to your mother, would that have influenced you? Or would you have been a product of your environment and carried on the abuse?

Does having a drunken asshole of a father give you a higher chance of being a drunken asshole yourself? How much of it is heredity and how much learnt response?

[Kaneman]

You just said it, influence. Not the reason. The influence.

You made a conscience decision to be more like your father, to respect his rules.

Now, if your father had been abusive to your mother, would that have influenced you? Or would you have been a product of your environment and carried on the abuse?

Its different for every person and its different again for victims of sexual abuse...but I never made a conscience decision to be more like my father.

[Tmall]

But, you did! Every single one of his influences on you is a decision you've made..

If you didn't decide, you wouldn't be that way.

[Kaneman]

But, you did! Every single one of his influences on you is a decision you've made..

If you didn't decide, you wouldn't be that way.

I disagree.

[Papa_Complex]

But, you did! Every single one of his influences on you is a decision you've made..

If you didn't decide, you wouldn't be that way.

The stronger the type of influence, the harder it is to shake. I would say rather than making a conscious decision to be like someone, it would take a conscious effort to be different.

[N2O Junkie]

another article says the 3 year old is his half sister.

this one has pics of the father/son
http://abcnews.go.com/WN/father-kills-son-molesting-sister/story?id=9127703

[101lifts2]

Two less people on welfare.

[Kaneman]

Two less people on welfare.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=uCbD9o948ec

[wildchild]

The father should be punished I agree ALTHOUGH I can't really blame him for wanting to do it...however you just can't do that and not expect to be prosecuted.

I feel bad for the mother/wife...she's lost her son and husband. I also feel bad for the child and their family.

As far as comparing it to putting down a dog...well that's wrong too in most cases but that's a whole 'nuther can of worms all together.


that pretty much sums it up. very hard to imagine being in that situation. you would be so pissed at him and yet embarrassed and yet..........but you still can't do that.

and how the hell can you pull a trigger on your own child? I don't care what they've done how could you do that?

[MILK]

4% of the population are thought to be Sociopaths, 1% of the population Narcissists.

According to the "Diagnostic and Statistical Manual of Mental Disorders IV" of the American Psychiatric Association the clinical diagnosis of Antisocial Personality disorder is considered when a person has at least 3 of the following characteristics:

1) Failure to to conform to social norms
2) Decitfulness, manipulativeness
3) Impulsivity, failure to plan ahead
4) Irritability, aggressiveness
5) Reckless disregard for the safety of others.
6) Consistent irresponsibility
7) Lack of remorse after having hurt, mistreated, or stolen from another person.

Sociopaths have no conscience, not necessarily that they are simply selfish. Sociopaths can't grasp what they are doing to other people, they lack empathy for others.

Narcissism

Narcissistic Personality Disorder (NPD) is a pattern of self-centered or egotistical behavior that shows up in thinking and behavior in a lot of different situations and activities.

1. An exaggerated sense of self-importance (e.g., exaggerates achievements and talents, expects to be recognized as superior without commensurate achievements)
2. Preoccupation with fantasies of unlimited success, power, brilliance, beauty, or ideal love
3. Believes he is "special" and can only be understood by, or should associate with, other special or high-status people (or institutions)
4. Requires excessive admiration
5. Has a sense of entitlement
6. Selfishly takes advantage of others to achieve his own ends
7. Lacks empathy
8. Is often envious of others or believes that others are envious of him
9. Shows arrogant, haughty, patronizing, or contemptuous behaviors or attitudes