too fat.......no degree

[RACER X]

http://apnews.myway.com/article/20091120/D9C3GV502.html


Pa. university students upset about fitness class


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Nov 20, 4:52 PM (ET)

By KATHY MATHESON
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PHILADELPHIA (AP) - A Pennsylvania university's requirement that overweight undergraduates take a fitness course to receive their degrees has raised the hackles of students and the eyebrows of health and legal experts.

Officials at historically black Lincoln University said Friday that the school is simply concerned about high rates of obesity and diabetes, especially in the African-American community.

"We know we're in the midst of an obesity epidemic," said James L. DeBoy, chairman of Lincoln's department of health, physical education and recreation. "We have an obligation to address this head on, knowing full well there's going to be some fallout."

The fallout began this week on Lincoln's campus about 45 miles southwest of Philadelphia, where seniors - the first class affected by the mandate - began realizing their last chance to take the class would be this spring.

Tiana Lawson, a 21-year-old senior, wrote in this week's edition of The Lincolnian, the student newspaper, that she "didn't come to Lincoln to be told that my weight is not in an acceptable range. I came here to get an education."

In an interview Friday, Lawson said she has no problem with getting healthy or losing weight. But she does have a problem with larger students being singled out.

"If Lincoln truly is concerned about everyone being healthy, then everyone should have to take this gym class, not just people who happen to be bigger," she said.

The mandate, which took effect for freshmen entering in fall 2006, requires students to get tested for their body mass index, a measure of weight to height.

A normal BMI is between 18.5 and 24.9. Students with one that's 30 or above - considered obese - are required to take a class called "Fitness for Life," which meets three hours a week.

The course involves walking, aerobics, weight training and other physical activities, as well as information on nutrition, stress and sleep, DeBoy said.

As of this fall, DeBoy estimated about 80 seniors - 16 percent of the class - had not had their body mass index tested nor taken the fitness class. Some of those students will likely be exempt from taking the class once they get their BMI results, he said.

Health experts applaud the school's intent, if not its execution. Mark Rothstein, director of the bioethics institute at the University of Louisville's School of Medicine, said being forced to disclose such health information is "at least awkward and often distasteful."

And it doesn't necessarily lead to the best outcomes, he said, noting that "when the (health) goals are imposed on people, they don't do that well in meeting them."

DeBoy stressed that students are not required to lose weight or lower their BMI; they must only pass the class through attendance and participation.

"It's the sound mind and the sound body concept," DeBoy said. "I think the university, to its credit, is trying to be proactive."

Some experts said recent amendments to the Americans with Disabilities Act might lead to exemptions for morbidly obese students, who could argue that participating in the class would be dangerous.

Also, students need more than exercise, said Marcia Costello, a registered dietitian in the Philadelphia area. The university should make sure its dining halls and vending machines offer healthy choices, she said.

Costello, an assistant professor of nursing at Villanova University, also noted that body mass index can be misleading. Since muscle weighs more than fat, "it is possible to be overweight and still be physically fit," she said.

Lawson, a mass communications major, said while she believes her current BMI would exempt her from the class, she's going to take it anyway "because I would like to be healthier."

"This was a decision that I made," she wrote in The Lincolnian, "and that's the way it ought to be."

---

Lincoln University: http://www.lincoln.edu

[CrazyKell]

Ridiculous.

They are under absolutely no obligation.

While it's great that the recognize there's an issue and clearly want to promote health, making mandatory fitness classes is ridiculous. Beyond ridiculous.

[Rider]

That's BS. There are plenty of body builders that have a BMI of near 30 that have under 10% body fat. BMI is such a farce. The only way to really know how fat you are is by the calipers and if you really want to get accurate, you need to be submerged in water.

[shmike]

That's BS. There are plenty of body builders that have a BMI of near 30 that have under 10% body fat. BMI is such a farce. The only way to really know how fat you are is by the calipers and if you really want to get accurate, you need to be submerged in water.

I doubt those BB's would bitch about taking this class.

It'd be an easy A.

The fatties are whining about having to take "PE", shocker.

DeBoy stressed that students are not required to lose weight or lower their BMI; they must only pass the class through attendance and participation.

[CrazyKell]

I doubt those BB's would bitch about taking this class.

It'd be an easy A.

The fatties are whining about having to take "PE", shocker.

They're whining about a requirement that has little to do with their education or specified degree.

I wasn't required to take a class in chemistry for my linguistics degree. How is this any different? :scratch:

[Rider]

I doubt those BB's would bitch about taking this class.

It'd be an easy A.

The fatties are whining about having to take "PE", shocker.

Good point.

[shmike]

They're whining about a requirement that has little to do with their education or specified degree.

I wasn't required to take a class in chemistry for my linguistics degree. How is this any different? :scratch:

You took no science in college? :scratch:

There were a number of classes that you WERE required to take that had absolutely no bearing on your degree. How is this any different?

[CrazyKell]

You took no science in college? :scratch:

There were a number of classes that you WERE required to take that had absolutely no bearing on your degree. How is this any different?

I was required to have a breadth of classes and subjects, of which I could choose from a variety of classes or courses. I was not required to take specific courses that were not required for my degree.


Saying you must take so many credits in science/english/whatever is not the same as saying you must take X course that has absolutely nothing to do with obtaining your degree.

[Homeslice]

I was required to have a breadth of classes and subjects, of which I could choose from a variety of classes or courses. I was not required to take specific courses that were not required for my degree.
.
Sure you were. You were probably required to take at least one history class, at least one writing class, at least one science class, etc.....

This is cut and dry. These kids were told 4 years ago what the requirements were. They had 4 years to meet them. They chose not to.

Go to a different school if you don't like the requirements. :idk:

[CrazyKell]

Sure you were. You were probably required to take at least one history class, at least one writing class, at least one science class, etc.....

This is cut and dry. These kids were told 4 years ago what the requirements were. They had 4 years to meet them. They chose not to.

Go to a different school if you don't like the requirements. :idk:

This is not a requirement for everyone. That I would have no problem with...same as history/english/science requirements.

This is a requirement only for those with a certain BMI. Using BMI to measure obesity is questionable at best.

[Trip]

I had two mandatory PE classes to get a fucking engineering degree.

Take the class fatties and shut up.

(This reminds me mmmmmm young tight british ass moving nicely underneath those shorty short walking shorts. God that girl was hot)

Any of you are required to take PE courses at college, TAKE WALKING. Yeah, it may sound stupid and girly (it is), but all kinds of hottie girls take that class and you can just walk behind them all and watch their little tight butts move around the track. mmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmm

[z06boy]

The mandate, which took effect for freshmen entering in fall 2006, requires students to get tested for their body mass index, a measure of weight to height.

Pretty much sums it up for me...they knew the requirements when they enrolled. :idk:

That's like when I joined the Marines...wonder how it would have gone over if I thought one of my requirements wasn't fair and they should not make me do it. :rofl: :rofl:

I don't agree with just going by BMI either and when I first read this I was in agreement that it is BS to require these students to do this BUT that was based on me thinking that the school had changed the requirements recently and were not requirements when these students enrolled...not the case.

They knew all along...too bad so sad...get to sweatin'. :lol:

[Kaneman]

Awesome. Now if we could only get similar requirements and training in public schools as well.

[CasterTroy]

I had two mandatory PE classes to get a fucking engineering degree.



Same here

I took raquetball at a black college and fooking DOMINATED :lmao:

[z06boy]

Awesome. Now if we could only get similar requirements and training in public schools as well.

It's definitely needed.

[Rider]

Awesome. Now if we could only get similar requirements and training in public schools as well.

No shit, PE not required? WTF? No wonder we have so many fatties.

[Homeslice]

This is not a requirement for everyone. That I would have no problem with...same as history/english/science requirements.

This is a requirement only for those with a certain BMI. Using BMI to measure obesity is questionable at best.

I agree that BMI alone is dumb. But, a private college can pretty much do whatever they want. Just like modelling agencies won't accept someone if they're ugly.

[CrazyKell]

I don't agree with just going by BMI either and when I first read this I was in agreement that it is BS to require these students to do this BUT that was based on me thinking that the school had changed the requirements recently and were not requirements when these students enrolled...not the case.

Okay, this I understand. While I don't necessarily agree with the class, if you knew it when you signed up then just do it and shut up. But the class in and of itself is a joke.

[Kaneman]

School should be used as a preparation for basic-advanced life skills, things you do or might have to do everyday as an adult. Manage your finances, monitor your credit, change a flat tire, run from point a to point b, solve a mathematically based problem, apply histories lessons to your own life and society as well and so on and so forth.

Instead it is used as a primarily preparation for college even though many students won't be attending. And secondly as a daily preparation for standardized tests that make the school look good or bad. You know how many standardized tests I've taken since I got out of high school? That's right, fucking none....but goddamn if we didn't practice for them everyday of my 4 years in HS. What a complete waste.

Using your body in a physical manner is something everyone of us does everyday. We should be all be trained in balance, strength, hand-eye coordination, etc. This is EVERY bit as important as math, science or even reading. Keeping your kid weak, flabby and sunless should not be an option for you just as sending them with a note to skip math because its too hard is not an option either. In fact, if you want weak flabby kids then home school them. The system that educates the majority of our population needs to put a very large emphasis on shaping us up.

Furthermore, from an education stand point, physically fit people perform much better on an intellectual level as well. One feeds the other. Strong bodies make for strong minds. This should be 100% common sense, kids who are exercised behave better and pay attention better.

ADHD, fat children, disease ridden schools, lack of confidence? Give me a motherfucking break. No shit kids can't sit still in class, they haven't gotten the first bit of exercise in a whole goddamn week. This is one more reason we are to fail as a society. Physical laziness.

[RACER X]

School should be used as a preparation for basic-advanced life skills, things you do or might have to do everyday as an adult. Manage your finances, monitor your credit, change a flat tire, run from point a to point b, solve a mathematically based problem, apply histories lessons to your own life and society as well and so on and so forth.

Instead it is used as a primarily preparation for college even though many students won't be attending. And secondly as a daily preparation for standardized tests that make the school look good or bad. You know how many standardized tests I've taken since I got out of high school? That's right, fucking none....but goddamn if we didn't practice for them everyday of my 4 years in HS. What a complete waste.

Using your body in a physical manner is something everyone of us does everyday. We should be all be trained in balance, strength, hand-eye coordination, etc. This is EVERY bit as important as math, science or even reading. Keeping your kid weak, flabby and sunless should not be an option for you just as sending them with a note to skip math because its too hard is not an option either. In fact, if you want weak flabby kids then home school them. The system that educates the majority of our population needs to put a very large emphasis on shaping us up.

Furthermore, from an education stand point, physically fit people perform much better on an intellectual level as well. One feeds the other. Strong bodies make for strong minds. This should be 100% common sense, kids who are exercised behave better and pay attention better.

ADHD, fat children, disease ridden schools, lack of confidence? Give me a motherfucking break. No shit kids can't sit still in class, they haven't gotten the first bit of exercise in a whole goddamn week. This is one more reason we are to fail as a society. Physical laziness.

fact or opinion?

cuz none of my family is very physical or into sports of any kinda, and top of the class and i mean like all of them besides me........lol

[Homeslice]

School should be used as a preparation for basic-advanced life skills, things you do or might have to do everyday as an adult. Manage your finances, monitor your credit, change a flat tire, run from point a to point b, solve a mathematically based problem, apply histories lessons to your own life and society as well and so on and so forth.

Instead it is used as a primarily preparation for college even though many students won't be attending. And secondly as a daily preparation for standardized tests that make the school look good or bad. You know how many standardized tests I've taken since I got out of high school? That's right, fucking none....but goddamn if we didn't practice for them everyday of my 4 years in HS. What a complete waste.

Using your body in a physical manner is something everyone of us does everyday. We should be all be trained in balance, strength, hand-eye coordination, etc. This is EVERY bit as important as math, science or even reading. Keeping your kid weak, flabby and sunless should not be an option for you just as sending them with a note to skip math because its too hard is not an option either. In fact, if you want weak flabby kids then home school them. The system that educates the majority of our population needs to put a very large emphasis on shaping us up.

Furthermore, from an education stand point, physically fit people perform much better on an intellectual level as well. One feeds the other. Strong bodies make for strong minds. This should be 100% common sense, kids who are exercised behave better and pay attention better.

ADHD, fat children, disease ridden schools, lack of confidence? Give me a motherfucking break. No shit kids can't sit still in class, they haven't gotten the first bit of exercise in a whole goddamn week. This is one more reason we are to fail as a society. Physical laziness.

+trillion

Although I would add that human/social skills are the most important thing to learn while you're that age.

[Homeslice]

fact or opinion?

cuz none of my family is very physical or into sports of any kinda, and top of the class and i mean like all of them besides me........lol

Yeah, and could they have gotten even better grades had they exercised? Probably. Cardiovascular fitness = better brain function.

[RACER X]

yeah, cuz a 4.1 is so much better then a 4.0........

common sense to me is that jocks are dumb
and smart kids and weak nurdy kids.

generally, my family = smart fat nurdy asian kids

[Kaneman]

Its not about being the smartest in the school, its about being the best physical specimen that you as an individual can possibly be.

You wanna have a health care debate? The first step to a true solution starts here.

[RACER X]

Its not about being the smartest in the school, its about being the best physical specimen that you as an individual can possibly be.

You wanna have a health care debate? The first step to a true solution starts here.

for asians, education (how smart) is alot more important then physical well being......:tremble:

[101lifts2]

They're whining about a requirement that has little to do with their education or specified degree.

I wasn't required to take a class in chemistry for my linguistics degree. How is this any different? :scratch:

I'm an electrical engineer, but had to take Dynamics, Thermodynamics, Strength of Materials, History, Sociology etc which has "little to do with my education". As long as I knew what classes I had to take beforehand, I do not see an issue with it. Now if the school changed the requirements during the year, then sure complain.

[101lifts2]

for asians, copying is alot more important then physical well being......:tremble:


Fixed it for ya.:lol

[Kaneman]

for asians, education (how smart) is alot more important then physical well being......:tremble:

Fuck them then, go back to Asia.

[101lifts2]

Same here

I took raquetball at a black college and fooking DOMINATED :lmao:

Yeah, but you woulda ate shit if it was basketball. :lol

[RACER X]

Fuck them then, go back to Asia.

sorry, we;re her to stay and 1 day rule the world.........

http://www.seespotruninc.com/images/Pinky_and_the_Brain_.jpg

if nothing else, in the end it'll be the messicans vs the chinks in a race war........whitey and blackie will no longer count as their #'s are dwindling.

[101lifts2]

School should be used as a preparation for basic-advanced life skills, things you do or might have to do everyday as an adult. Manage your finances, monitor your credit, change a flat tire, run from point a to point b, solve a mathematically based problem, apply histories lessons to your own life and society as well and so on and so forth.

Instead it is used as a primarily preparation for college even though many students won't be attending. And secondly as a daily preparation for standardized tests that make the school look good or bad. You know how many standardized tests I've taken since I got out of high school? That's right, fucking none....but goddamn if we didn't practice for them everyday of my 4 years in HS. What a complete waste.

Using your body in a physical manner is something everyone of us does everyday. We should be all be trained in balance, strength, hand-eye coordination, etc. This is EVERY bit as important as math, science or even reading. Keeping your kid weak, flabby and sunless should not be an option for you just as sending them with a note to skip math because its too hard is not an option either. In fact, if you want weak flabby kids then home school them. The system that educates the majority of our population needs to put a very large emphasis on shaping us up.

Furthermore, from an education stand point, physically fit people perform much better on an intellectual level as well. One feeds the other. Strong bodies make for strong minds. This should be 100% common sense, kids who are exercised behave better and pay attention better.

ADHD, fat children, disease ridden schools, lack of confidence? Give me a motherfucking break. No shit kids can't sit still in class, they haven't gotten the first bit of exercise in a whole goddamn week. This is one more reason we are to fail as a society. Physical laziness.

While I think this makes sense from a logical point of view, realistically it doesn't. You need people with specialized talent to make the world go round. You always have a large base who excel at nothing, but can perform common sense tasks. But...a jack of all trades cannot perform open heart surgery, fly a jet or design a circuit board. Point being whether their BMI is 30 or less shouldn't really matter.

[Homeslice]

if nothing else, in the end it'll be the messicans vs the chinks in a race war........whitey and blackie will no longer count as their #'s are dwindling.
chinks = just chinese, you forgot about indians, indonesians, etc.

[RACER X]

indonesians are gonna get swept away when the polar ice caps melts so no worries their #'s will dwindle significantly, indians don't eat beef so their wooses. now worries about them.........lol

[Kaneman]

While I think this makes sense from a logical point of view, realistically it doesn't. You need people with specialized talent to make the world go round. You always have a large base who excel at nothing, but can perform common sense tasks. But...a jack of all trades cannot perform open heart surgery, fly a jet or design a circuit board. Point being whether their BMI is 30 or less shouldn't really matter.

I'm not talking about BMI, I'm talking about basic physical fitness and muscle development that is part of the human species. I'm in no way advocating preparing all U.S. students to play in the NFL, run marathons, ride a bicycle 80 miles in a day or anything of the sort. Basic physical fitness and upkeep for all physically able humans.

Those with disabilities should have modified guidelines so that they too can be at the best of their physical ability. There will still be those that are taller, shorter, chubbier and skinnier...but we should all meet a minimum requirement as part of our public education.

[goof2]

Its not about being the smartest in the school, its about being the best physical specimen that you as an individual can possibly be.

You wanna have a health care debate? The first step to a true solution starts here.

That is your priority. I wish you well at it. An overwhelming majority of Americans are not interested in, to paraphrase, being the best physical specimen they can possibly be though. That is a great thing about this country; people can decide what their priorities are (health, education, video games, etc.) and allocate their time and energy accordingly. To me imposing your priority on others doesn't sound like a "true solution" to anything.

[Kaneman]

That is your priority. I wish you well at it. An overwhelming majority of Americans are not interested in, to paraphrase, being the best physical specimen they can possibly be though. That is a great thing about this country; people can decide what their priorities are (health, education, video games, etc.) and allocate their time and energy accordingly. To me imposing your priority on others doesn't sound like a "true solution" to anything.

I don't give a flying fuck what they're interested in, when I become king of the public school system those little fuckers are going to learn how to keep their bodies in basic shape...or they're going to fail at life and school.

[goof2]

I don't give a flying fuck what they're interested in, when I become king of the public school system those little fuckers are going to learn how to keep their bodies in basic shape...or they're going to fail at life and school.

There are plenty of fit people who fail at life.

[Kaneman]

There are plenty of fit people who fail at life.

No shit, its not the point.

[Homeslice]

We already require kids to meet certain standards in math, reading and writing. So in effect, they are already being "imposed upon" :idk:

[101lifts2]

I'm not talking about BMI, I'm talking about basic physical fitness and muscle development that is part of the human species. I'm in no way advocating preparing all U.S. students to play in the NFL, run marathons, ride a bicycle 80 miles in a day or anything of the sort. Basic physical fitness and upkeep for all physically able humans.

Those with disabilities should have modified guidelines so that they too can be at the best of their physical ability. There will still be those that are taller, shorter, chubbier and skinnier...but we should all meet a minimum requirement as part of our public education.

We evolved to be physically fit since you couldn't go to a drive up Mickey D's and order a hamburger. However, now it is simply not needed other than to reduce health care costs.

[goof2]

No shit, its not the point.

What is?

[Kaneman]

What is?

That the lack of physical fitness in America is leading to numerous problems that could easily be solved by a public education system that took said fitness seriously.

There are more specific posts on the previous page for your reading enjoyment, feel free to examine them before replying.

[shmike]

That the lack of physical fitness in America is leading to numerous problems that could easily be solved by a public education system that took said fitness seriously.

There are more specific posts on the previous page for your reading enjoyment, feel free to examine them before replying.

I agree with much of your premise but putting it back on the schools is no better than the parents that expect the schools to teach their kids about life.

Learning begins at home, physical education included.

[goof2]

That the lack of physical fitness in America is leading to numerous problems that could easily be solved by a public education system that took said fitness seriously.

There are more specific posts on the previous page for your reading enjoyment, feel free to examine them before replying.

I have read them. That is the problem. You advocate different things in your posts. While I agree that physical education should be a component of public education, I don't agree with forcing kids to be "the best physical specimen that you as an individual can possibly be".

[RACER X]

sounds alot like nazi germany........lol

[Rider]

sounds alot like nazi germany........lol

Whats wrong with that? You ever see a fat person who survived Auschwitz?
Didn't think so.

[CrazyKell]

sounds alot like nazi germany........lol

No, no it doesn't. It sounds a lot like Nazi Germany.

:didntdo:

[z06boy]

No, no it doesn't. It sounds a lot like Nazi Germany.

:didntdo:

Right here is the reason I have so many edited post. :lol: I'm usually short for time...post fast and then read my post a little later and see a typo and think CRAP...hurry and edit before the grammar Nazi's see this !! :rofl:

[Kaneman]

I agree with much of your premise but putting it back on the schools is no better than the parents that expect the schools to teach their kids about life.

Learning begins at home, physical education included.

Yet we don't expect parents to teach kids how to do a book report, long division or science experiments.

I have read them. That is the problem. You advocate different things in your posts. While I agree that physical education should be a component of public education, I don't agree with forcing kids to be "the best physical specimen that you as an individual can possibly be".

Does the school system not constantly preach doing the best you can at the various subjects they offer as it is? I see no difference in helping kids reach a higher ground physically as well.

No, no it doesn't. It sounds a lot like Nazi Germany.

:didntdo:

Exactly. Well, except for that vicious hate, racism and genocide thing. Just like Nazi Germany though.

[CrazyKell]

Right here is the reason I have so many edited post. :lol: I'm usually short for time...post fast and then read my post a little later and see a typo and think CRAP...hurry and edit before the grammar Nazi's see this !! :rofl:

This is far from a typo. And truth be told I'm just raggin' on Ed a bit. All in good fun. :D

[goof2]

Does the school system not constantly preach doing the best you can at the various subjects they offer as it is? I see no difference in helping kids reach a higher ground physically as well.

They do preach that message. It is called "lip service". The fact is that the public school system taking fitness seriously accomplishes little to nothing. The students themselves have to take it seriously. Schools have next to no control over that.

[Kaneman]

They do preach that message. It is called "lip service". The fact is that the public school system taking fitness seriously accomplishes little to nothing. The students themselves have to take it seriously. Schools have next to no control over that.

And they will, when they don't pass 5th grade because they couldn't cover a mile on foot in under 45 minutes.

*Disclaimer: I am no physical health or child physiology expert so I will leave the exact specifications per age group up to the experts that my administration will be hiring under my direct supervision.

[Smittie61984]

I had two mandatory PE classes to get a fucking engineering degree.


My buddy got his MET and he had to take 2 PE classes. So he took walking and bowling. How fucking hard is that? Hell, he didn't even have to walk or bowl and still aced the class.

[Homeslice]

WTF is a class in walking? Jesus how fukcing stupid.

[Apoc]

I think its a great idea. Get the lazy fucks off their asses. Im one of them, I had to recently force myself to get off the internet so much and start excercising again, after problems and 3rd degree burns I was lazier than ever.

I disgust myself with my fatness, and other fat people disgust me too. Maybe showing them how they cant even run the bases anymore will open their eyes.

Im all for the regulation of food and excercise in schools, of all levels, by the governement.

Military Service too. The older I get, the more I hate young people. :lol:

[Ineffable]

I applaud the school on the idea just not on the execution. I'm not saying anything that hasn't already been said in this thread but... A sound body does make a sound mind. They were given the requirements in 2006, 4 FUCKING YEARS AGO. They chose to ignore it and now it is biting them in the ass so they complain about it. I agree BMI may not be the best way to measure obesity but at the same time on the point of students having to 'disclose that kind of medical information' is BS, it's not like it is something an observer can't see on a day to day basis, you are fat it's not some kind of medical secret only you and your doctor know. This kind of policy should be put into effect in all public schools but required for all children. As far as in college I think what would help here is if the 'skinny' people had to take some kind of nutrition class. Just because you aren't overweight doesn't mean you are healthy. Nutrition for the skinnies PE for the fatties everyone wins.

[Papa_Complex]

Do they get extra credit if their teacher is fat?