Sand in the corner

[No Worries]

We have had snow almost every weekend. But yesterday it was 60 and I took my Suzuki up Lookout Mt. Here's a switchback with sand covering the apex. It doesn't look too bad, but it's so steep you can't see it until you're almost upon it. What did I do?

http://img9.imageshack.us/img9/7255/lookoutsand.jpg (http://img9.imageshack.us/i/lookoutsand.jpg/)

First I cursed out the public works for dumping sand there. Second, I was looking around the corner and saw that the downhill lane was clear of sand, and there was no traffic coming down. I leaned a little more, pushed a little more, and went into the other lane. I stopped on the way down and took the picture.

[Trip]

a better idea is to do a scouting run before where you can control your vehicle in your own lane and have enough control to avoid obstacles.

[smileyman]

Arkriders.com where I moderate has had a guy go down in the sand. These post winter roads are covered either by sand trucks or melting runoff. Then there are the frost heaves in the asphalt. You got to be careful...

[tached1000rr]

good post

[Adeptus_Minor]

You were warned ;)

http://www.twowheelfix.com/showthread.php?t=13352

[marko138]

I like to wait for a good soaking rain before I ride because of this kind of stuff.

[pauldun170]

Spend half the time looking for broken up pavement and the other half identifying where sand collects.

or just stick to the casual scenic routes for a bit longer till the green starts showing up (aka allergy season)

[Sixxxxer]

Luckily I think jersey is getting its "cleansing" rain this weekend...hopefully it clears out the roads and gets that asphalt somewhat clear of the salt/sand. That's a wicked corner to fuck around with. Be cautious out there people

[marko138]

Luckily I think jersey is getting its "cleansing" rain this weekend...hopefully it clears out the roads and gets that asphalt somewhat clear of the salt/sand. That's a wicked corner to fuck around with. Be cautious out there people
Same here...supposed to rain tonight right through Monday. Then back to the upper 50's and beyond. And daylight savings time.

[derf]

Luckily I think jersey is getting its "cleansing" rain this weekend...hopefully it clears out the roads and gets that asphalt somewhat clear of the salt/sand. That's a wicked corner to fuck around with. Be cautious out there people

The roads are still kind bad here, piles of sand and salt everywhere

[wildchild]

We have had snow almost every weekend. But yesterday it was 60 and I took my Suzuki up Lookout Mt. Here's a switchback with sand covering the apex. It doesn't look too bad, but it's so steep you can't see it until you're almost upon it. What did I do?

http://img9.imageshack.us/img9/7255/lookoutsand.jpg (http://img9.imageshack.us/i/lookoutsand.jpg/)

First I cursed out the public works for dumping sand there. Second, I was looking around the corner and saw that the downhill lane was clear of sand, and there was no traffic coming down. I leaned a little more, pushed a little more, and went into the other lane. I stopped on the way down and took the picture.

sounds like a rookie mistake. poorly handled.

[CrazyKell]

I don't even consider putting my bike on the road until they're clear and clean.

[Rider]

Scouting run in the cage would help.

[itgirl]

a better idea is to do a scouting run before where you can control your vehicle in your own lane and have enough control to avoid obstacles.

sounds like a rookie mistake. poorly handled.

no worries is a skilled and seasoned rider. we could all learn alot from him. i think he made an excellent snap judement call. of course, scouting runs would be a good idea in a perfect world with ideal situations. but his decision sure beats dumping the bike in the corner.

[Cutty72]

I don't even consider putting my bike on the road until they're clear and clean.

I'd never get to ride! :lol:

With all the rural areas around here, the is always sand and gravel on the roads.

[Trip]

no worries is a skilled and seasoned rider. we could all learn alot from him. i think he made an excellent snap judement call. of course, scouting runs would be a good idea in a perfect world with ideal situations. but his decision sure beats dumping the bike in the corner.

I am a skilled and seasoned rider as well. Using the other lane is never a good idea. It's last resort if you are going to plow into someone. His mistake wasn't the sand, his mistake was riding beyond the conditions of the road. Scouting runs and riding easy in unknown conditions isn't ideal situations in a perfect world, they are smart decisions by seasoned riders. Riding beyond the limits of the road and sight distance is a true blue rookie mistake.

[marko138]

I am a skilled and seasoned rider as well. Using the other lane is never a good idea. It's last resort if you are going to plow into someone. His mistake wasn't the sand, his mistake was riding beyond the conditions of the road. Scouting runs and riding easy in unknown conditions isn't ideal situations in a perfect world, they are smart decisions by seasoned riders. Riding beyond the limits of the road and sight distance is a true blue rookie mistake.
So we should believe you've never used the other lane?

[Particle Man]

roads here are like the freakin' Sahara, there's so much sand

[Trip]

So we should believe you've never used the other lane?

Yes I use it for passing. However I don't recommend the use of it.

[AquaPython]

i thought for sure this would be a sand in my bergina thread.

[wildchild]

no worries is a skilled and seasoned rider. we could all learn alot from him. i think he made an excellent snap judement call. of course, scouting runs would be a good idea in a perfect world with ideal situations. but his decision sure beats dumping the bike in the corner.


thanks but I gave up assuming the roads were clear of sand/salt/crap back in my teens and that was quite a few years ago. as far as using the other lane because you've gone too fast into a corner while assuming it is clear. Yeah I would not call that a great move either. survival move to avoid crashing due to mistakes sure but not smart all the way through.

[itgirl]

again i state, in a pinch it sure beats the alternative. sometimes you only have time to react. that's reality. you do what you gotta do.

[No Worries]

I've ridden up Lookout Mountain at least a thousand times. You wouldn't believe all the trash, animals, rocks, and vehicles that have been in my lane around the next corner, so every ride is like a scouting run. That sand is one thing that was still there on the way down when I happened to stop and happened to have my camera.

I wanted to show that I had my head cranked, that I was looking around the corner and not fixated on the sand. That I saw that there was no traffic, that I made a decision to go around the sand, and that I was able to lean a bit more. There was nobody behind me, but I hope it looked so smooth, that anyone else would have thought I had planned it.

Speaking of sand, did anyone see Keith Code's column a few months ago about putting sand in a corner? He used one of his bikes with the outriggers so it can't tip over. He put sand in a corner and told his students to just ride through the sand. The ones that just rode through had no problem. The ones who braked or tensed up "crashed".

There's always sand on roads around here after it snows, but there's usually clear tire tracks through it. There was no tire tracks through this sand. I probably could have ridden through it, but it was easier to just avoid it.

[OreoGaborio]

So we should believe you've never used the other lane?
I think the point he was trying to make was that, although riding into the oncoming lane could be ONE option, it should never be your ONLY option... because now you're putting your fate in the hands of luck that no one is coming the other way.

However I suspect (hope) that No Worries probably could have probably slowed down enough to roll through it had the oncoming lane been occupied by a tractor trailer. But since the it was open, he made the choice to use that option over slowing and rolling through it, around it, whatever.

Now if going into the oncoming lane was in fact his ONLY option... then yah, rookie mistake. But he never said it was his ONLY option, thus we can't judge.

[tommymac]

I like to wait for a good soaking rain before I ride because of this kind of stuff.

Like today and tomorrow

[tommymac]

roads here are like the freakin' Sahara, there's so much sand

Me and a buddy went out riding last sat. we stuck to main roads and even they were a mess so I could only imagine what some of the backroads we like look like at this time. Besides most of us take it real easy early in the year, gotta shake off the winter rust and contend with poor road conditions.

[marko138]

Yes I use it for passing. However I don't recommend the use of it.

Ok, so your post is hypocritical.

Like today and tomorrow

Yes, 3" expected here. And back to the 60* Tuesday. Might be a good time to RIDE!

[tommymac]

Ok, so your post is hypocritical.



Yes, 3" expected here. And back to the 60* Tuesday. Might be a good time to RIDE!


It def will be. I am going to call today to see about getting the buell in for its first service. th efutura is still waiting on a voltage regulator so I need to harass the guy/place I am buying it from to get that happening and I will be good to go:rockwoot:

work schedule isnt too bad this comming week so i want to start logging some miles.

[marko138]

It def will be. I am going to call today to see about getting the buell in for its first service. th efutura is still waiting on a voltage regulator so I need to harass the guy/place I am buying it from to get that happening and I will be good to go:rockwoot:

work schedule isnt too bad this comming week so i want to start logging some miles.
I need an inspection. But I really dont care about that. :lol: I'd rather buy ammo.

[Trip]

Ok, so your post is hypocritical.

No because I don't recommend it as an escape route or applicable for use. If you want to use it, that's up to you. I would never give advice with using it.

I definitely don't use it in corners.

[OreoGaborio]

Ok, so your post is hypocritical
his post is situational....

this argument is dumb.

[sfarson]

No Worries... In the motorcycling Colorado book I just sent off to the publisher I call to attention the horrible, unrestrained practice CDOT and County Road & Bridge departments have with the dumping of sand on roads. I also call out annual county habits of pouring dirt on road shoulders which makes the corners filthy from cars cutting the corners... right where we don't want the slippery grit. Safer alternatives are suggested as well.

[marko138]

No Worries... In the motorcycling Colorado book I just sent off to the publisher I call to attention the horrible, unrestrained practice CDOT and County Road & Bridge departments have with the dumping of sand on roads. I also call out annual county habits of pouring dirt on road shoulders which makes the corners filthy from cars cutting the corners... right where we don't want the slippery grit. Safer alternatives are suggested as well.
Good work, brother.

[No Worries]

No Worries... In the motorcycling Colorado book I just sent off to the publisher I call to attention the horrible, unrestrained practice CDOT and County Road & Bridge departments have with the dumping of sand on roads. I also call out annual county habits of pouring dirt on road shoulders which makes the corners filthy from cars cutting the corners... right where we don't want the slippery grit. Safer alternatives are suggested as well.

Congrats on finishing and getting your book published. I'm looking forward to buying a copy.

That's interesting you mention the sand, and Road and Bridge dept. I rode Lookout Mt. on Wednesday and the road was covered with sand. I never saw it so bad. Even the cage drivers at Buffalo Bills were pissed. I called up Jefferson County Road and Bridge at Lookout and complained. The guy was a motorcyclist, but said he had to sand for the cars. I then called up their main office at Golden Gate. They said they didn't have to, but they liked to sweep up the sand by three days after a storm to reduce the brown cloud. I rode Lookout yesterday and it actually had been swept. Why don't you run for public office? We could use some motorcyclist lawmakers.

[sfarson]

Oh I've exchanged many messages with the head of JeffCo R&B. Got a little heated about ten months ago when a friend behind me went down due to the sand. Almost lost a leg. Where it stands now is they want to have lunch with me. I don't think I would be a good politician. :eek: :)

Hey FWIW, one of the 170+ chapters is on Lookout Mountain Road, with several historical photos included. Here's a sneak preview... 90 years ago when the "auto road" was built and today:

http://www.farson.com/preview/prevlookoutthen.jpg

http://www.farson.com/preview/prevlookout.jpg

[fasternyou929]

I know it's not what you're trying to highlight with those two pictures, but it's amazing how much more detail a nice black and white photo can pick up. Looking at the mountain on the left in each picture, all I see is a flat green hill in the color picture while in the black and white there are very clear ridges and valleys.

I'll have to go look at some of my pictures from Hawaii in black and white and see how they compare.

[Phenix_Rider]

I know it's not what you're trying to highlight with those two pictures, but it's amazing how much more detail a nice black and white photo can pick up. Looking at the mountain on the left in each picture, all I see is a flat green hill in the color picture while in the black and white there are very clear ridges and valleys.

I'll have to go look at some of my pictures from Hawaii in black and white and see how they compare.

The basic terrain elements are still there, but you have to account for a century's worth of erosion. Then there's the lighting...

[fasternyou929]

The basic terrain elements are still there, but you have to account for a century's worth of erosion. Then there's the lighting...

Drastically visible errosion in 90 years? I think not.

[The Awesome]

Sighting runs are boring, but they prevent easily avoidable emergency situations like this one. Never ass-u-me.

[sfarson]

Drastically visible errosion in 90 years? I think not.

I think part of the clarity diff is the B&W image has much of the terrain in the sun, creating a texture of outline and shadow, while the color image is mostly in the dull overcast shade except for where the sun is pouring its rays on the divine road.

[Phenix_Rider]

Drastically visible errosion in 90 years? I think not.

Depends on the soil. In the last 5 years, I've seen 20 feet of ground disappear off the back of the family farm.

And then there's the lighting of the photo. The angle of the sun and whether it's flat cloudy light or a harsh clear day makes a huge difference.

[fasternyou929]

Depends on the soil. In the last 5 years, I've seen 20 feet of ground disappear off the back of the family farm.

And then there's the lighting of the photo. The angle of the sun and whether it's flat cloudy light or a harsh clear day makes a huge difference.

Soil? That's ROCK man, not dirt piled up 14,000 feet high. The Rocky mountains are millions of years old; you're not going to see visible errosion in 90 years or they'd have been gone before any of us were here to see them.

I know about the lighting differences, I was just commenting the green looked washed out compared to grayscale. I've taken pictures of mountains on the East coast, in Colorado, Hawaii, and China. And every single time I look at the pictures I think "that doesn't do it any justice compared to seeing it in person". Mostly because the greens and blues seem to run together, so I was impressed with the detail in that came through in the subtle differences of the black and white picture. That's all.

[Gas Man]

sfarson... pls provide us with info on your book when it comes out. I know I will buy a copy. I have been a fan of your video's for many years now. This you know.

[marko138]

sfarson... pls provide us with info on your book when it comes out. I know I will buy a copy. I have been a fan of your video's for many years now. This you know.
Same here. Always enjoy his threads.

[sfarson]

Will do. Now that I can come up for air with the thing finished and shipped to the publisher, can hang the hat around here more often.

Hey marko... Picked up a sweet Buell Ulysses last summer. :yes:

Steve

[Gas Man]

Well get to postin more about things man. Get up some pics of your new buell.

[marko138]

Will do. Now that I can come up for air with the thing finished and shipped to the publisher, can hang the hat around here more often.

Hey marko... Picked up a sweet Buell Ulysses last summer. :yes:

Steve
Awesome man. Do you still have the Tuber?