View Full Version : Maintenance - schedule or whenever?
racedoll
04-03-2010, 10:18 PM
Do you follow the owner's manual schedule or just do your maintenance whenever?
Gas Man
04-03-2010, 10:27 PM
Follow MOCO schedule plus some.
remember on american vtwins I have 3 different oils (motor, primary, trans). I change all 3 EVERYTIME regardless.
smileyman
04-03-2010, 10:27 PM
I usually do more maintenance than the manual requires. My upbringing demands it. My Dad was a pro mechanic for 35 yrs, was my crew cheif racing. It is second nature.
pauldun170
04-03-2010, 10:30 PM
I'm old fashioned. I change the oil every 3 months or 3000 miles whichever comes first.
Everything else I do by schedule or need
I change the oil on my bike every 3000 miles on the dot. I lube the chain regularly, check other stuff when I feel like it
My car sorta whenever I feel like it around 5000 miles
racedoll
04-03-2010, 11:08 PM
I'm hearing a lot about oil but what about the other stuff, like forks? This is what made me think of this topic...
I was talking with a friend, basically said they will wait until their forks leak before having them serviced. Mine weren't leaking the first time I had them, just felt it was time. I had about 10K miles on the bike. This last time they were definitely not right so I had them done again, just in 1500 miles (last summer versus now).
marko138
04-03-2010, 11:09 PM
Mostly follow the schedule...or try to as closely as possible. Oil I change a little more often than recommened..but nothing major.
tached1000rr
04-03-2010, 11:19 PM
In terms of seals, its purpose is to prevent fluid from leaking, if its not leaking then I see no reason to mess with it unless it's one of those deals where you are already pulling something apart that would necessitate removal of the part anyway. Just me....
In terms of seals, its purpose is to prevent fluid from leaking, if its not leaking then I see no reason to mess with it unless it's one of those deals where you are already pulling something apart that would necessitate removal of the part anyway. Just me....
Spoken like a man who knows his shit.
Why mess with something unless its broken? I'll look at the forks to see if there is oil on them, if the bike acts funny I'll look into it. New noises are always worth investigating, and anything that isn't the same as yesterday gets a look at. But i'm not going to tear apart the front end of the bike to change fork seals because I rolled 10k miles
Gas Man
04-04-2010, 05:15 AM
Honestly... that is your stand on forks. Better recheck it.
The reason you tear into a fork that is not leaking is... well actually 2 reasons.
1. To prevent from leaking, as stated.
2. To put in new bushings. At which point you have to pull apart forks anyway, and only a moron would use old parts like seals then.
Don't replace the bushings... well that's not so smart. The bushing is what the leg rides against in the fork lower. Once it wears off its brass its done and will start to eat away the fork lower. Not good. That is why you service your forks before they start leaking.
Need more?
Example... here is the fork bushings on my chopper at 6k miles. I only did them cause they were off the bike anyway. But they weren't due till 10k. You can laready see the worn effect on the bushing.
http://i99.photobucket.com/albums/l311/cjclark69/BDM/Fork%20Service/SealsnOil011.jpg
Further, the fork oil was horrible
http://i99.photobucket.com/albums/l311/cjclark69/BDM/Fork%20Service/SealsnOil008.jpg
So then new parts and new oil...
http://i99.photobucket.com/albums/l311/cjclark69/BDM/Fork%20Service/SealsnOil035.jpg
marko138
04-04-2010, 08:24 AM
My forks will be done on schedule. Leaking or not.
tached1000rr
04-04-2010, 08:30 AM
An evil chopper like you had Gasman would eat its children!:D
Sportbikes are just not that evil.:lol:)
Case in point, Jared has what 177,000 miles last I know of, ask how many times his forks or fork seals have been replaced over the course of those miles. He had just had them rebuilt roughly a month before his unfortunate accident.
Gas Man
04-04-2010, 04:51 PM
That is true and a good point tach. But honestly I'm just explaining the works of it all. I can post pics of bushings off my 9R later when on my pc.
Cutty72
04-04-2010, 04:59 PM
What is this maintenance you speak of? :lol:
racedoll
04-04-2010, 07:50 PM
Honestly... that is your stand on forks. Better recheck it.
The reason you tear into a fork that is not leaking is... well actually 2 reasons.
1. To prevent from leaking, as stated.
2. To put in new bushings. At which point you have to pull apart forks anyway, and only a moron would use old parts like seals then.
Don't replace the bushings... well that's not so smart. The bushing is what the leg rides against in the fork lower. Once it wears off its brass its done and will start to eat away the fork lower. Not good. That is why you service your forks before they start leaking.
My thoughts exactly, but as tached proved, we don't all think the same way. That is why I posted this thread to see what kind of answers I would get.
My forks have bushings but if they need replaced then I will be replacing the entire fork body as they are non-replaceable on their own. Erik's are the same way. Parts guy even called Kayaba to see if they sold something. Nope. So just seals for us, but I guess you could inspect the bushing at that time.
Case in point, Jared has what 177,000 miles last I know of, ask how many times his forks or fork seals have been replaced over the course of those miles. He had just had them rebuilt roughly a month before his unfortunate accident.
Calm down. As I mentioned above we each do things differently and I wanted to see what others had to say. Neither way is right or wrong, just our way.
tached1000rr
04-04-2010, 07:56 PM
Racedoll, did my response sound like I was upset? If so, let me clarify that I was not.:didntdo:
eh, i fix things when the bike tells me too
racedoll
04-04-2010, 08:01 PM
Racedoll, did my response sound like I was upset? If so, let me clarify that I was not.:didntdo:
Not upset, but just kind of defensive. No reason to be. GM and I have different views than others, and that is perfectly OK.
tached1000rr
04-04-2010, 08:23 PM
Not upset, but just kind of defensive. No reason to be. GM and I have different views than others, and that is perfectly OK.
I was not being defensive or perhaps should say not my intent and Gasman agreed with me regarding the different forces at play on his chopper vs the sportbike which is what the whole Jared's bike example was about.
Gasman, post of a pic of the 9R bushing when you can, and how many miles did it have on it?
Racedoll, just curious if you asked Mike if he saw any wear while he was inside that fork?
racedoll
04-04-2010, 08:35 PM
I was not being defensive or perhaps should say not my intent and Gasman agreed with me regarding the different forces at play on his chopper vs the sportbike which is what the whole Jared's bike example was about.
Gasman, post of a pic of the 9R bushing when you can, and how many miles did it have on it?
Racedoll, just curious if you asked Mike if he saw any wear while he was inside that fork?
OK.
Mike never said a word about my internals so they are good. He would have definitely said something if it wasn't right. He is very picky and meticulous, it is why we take our stuff to him.
Gas Man
04-04-2010, 09:18 PM
Yeah its good, I don't care either way. I'm just saying, if the manufacture says to service them, do it. Do you think you know better than they do?
My 9R bushings were still in great shape but I didn't do the forks. That was before I got really into my own wrenching... so a race shop did them.
http://i99.photobucket.com/albums/l311/cjclark69/ZX9R/Forksareback004.jpg
http://i99.photobucket.com/albums/l311/cjclark69/ZX9R/Forksareback003.jpg
I can't remember how many miles but it was a 2002 bike. 15k miles or close
The first bushing is barely worn... the 2nd is slightly worn. But then again I didn't wheelie or hard on my bikes. BUt yes as tach stated... hardly worn compared to the chopper.
Honestly in a sportbike... there is a huge change for the good by just changing the oil to some good ohlins syn oil.
racedoll
04-04-2010, 09:25 PM
As posted in my Cleaned and ready thread - I changed my spark plugs today.
I asked Erik on Friday (when I was picking up oil, filter, etc) if I needed to change my spark plugs as it had been 6000 miles. He said no.
I checked them today and ended up replacing them as they were black. Thankfully the auto parts store was open today. He would have never guessed that I needed to do that just after that low of mileage but I did.
Gas Man
04-04-2010, 09:28 PM
I use to change them on my 9R every year. Way over kill but there was no way I was going to pull them and not just replace them.
Look familiar?
http://i99.photobucket.com/albums/l311/cjclark69/ZX9R/SpringTime011.jpg
http://i99.photobucket.com/albums/l311/cjclark69/ZX9R/blinkermod009.jpg
Particle Man
04-04-2010, 09:51 PM
Mostly follow the schedule...or try to as closely as possible. Oil I change a little more often than recommened..but nothing major.
Word-for-word, this.
Do you think you know better than they do?
Not better than them. We have competing interests, The manufacturer wants me to service my bike at an authorized service shop for everything, they expect a majority of the people to have a shop do their servicing. This keeps their dealership network open. yes their service schedule is going to be very conservative. There are plenty of other reasons why they make their service intervals so short.
But i also say that with the understanding that I dont own a bike that has a super crazy service schedule. If I had a duc, yes I would be much more dilligent about servicing it, checking the valves every 150 miles and such. Being that I have a honda I believe I can stretch the service interval out a wee bit.
njchopper87
04-04-2010, 10:28 PM
Whenever. I'm still learning about everything I'm supposed to be doing and I don't have much money to throw around. I do what's required (oil and filters and shit like that) and stretch the rest. I wish I still lived in Jersey though.. my next door neighbor was a mechanic and he'd help out no questions asked for beer or a return favor.
Gas Man
04-05-2010, 01:00 AM
I hear ya Derf...
hell really for the most part the average person is still overkill on regular oil changes. I think I saw something on your oil breaks down mostly in the first 500 miles. Than it really doesn't do much less. The biggest important part is the oil filter cause once they get gunked up they just go into bypass. But the oil itself can go much longer than we run it.
marko138
04-05-2010, 08:03 AM
Not better than them. We have competing interests, The manufacturer wants me to service my bike at an authorized service shop for everything, they expect a majority of the people to have a shop do their servicing. This keeps their dealership network open. yes their service schedule is going to be very conservative. There are plenty of other reasons why they make their service intervals so short.
But i also say that with the understanding that I dont own a bike that has a super crazy service schedule. If I had a duc, yes I would be much more dilligent about servicing it, checking the valves every 150 miles and such. Being that I have a honda I believe I can stretch the service interval out a wee bit.
You would check your valves after every tank of gas? No fucking way.
azoomm
04-05-2010, 09:54 AM
But i also say that with the understanding that I dont own a bike that has a super crazy service schedule. If I had a duc, yes I would be much more dilligent about servicing it, checking the valves every 150 miles and such. Being that I have a honda I believe I can stretch the service interval out a wee bit.
:lol:
Ducati motorcycles are NOT that high maintainance. But, I find it awesome you would check the valves after you get half-way through a tank of gas.
When I had an odometer, I followed the maintainance schedule to a T. Now that it's a track/race bike - I follow the calendar rather than the miles. Oil changes every three months, valve check once a year. I just had the suspension taken care of - and the rest is taken care of and tracked [brakes/chain/tires/plugs/etc.].
remember on american vtwins I have 3 different oils (motor, primary, trans). I change all 3 EVERYTIME regardless.
My Bavarian master piece also has 3 that have to be changed. Motor, Tranny, and Final drive. Tranny and Final drive are the same type of oil though.
I hear ya Derf...
hell really for the most part the average person is still overkill on regular oil changes. I think I saw something on your oil breaks down mostly in the first 500 miles. Than it really doesn't do much less. The biggest important part is the oil filter cause once they get gunked up they just go into bypass. But the oil itself can go much longer than we run it.
heh i told fred this when we rode saturday but after i resurrected the 450 i rode it for about six months on the 26 year old oil. No shards at change either.
goof2
04-05-2010, 11:00 AM
I use to change them on my 9R every year. Way over kill but there was no way I was going to pull them and not just replace them.
The recommended interval for a check, clean, regap, or replace on my bike's spark plugs is every 6 months or 6,000 km. I haven't been good about this and I suspect the previous owners weren't either.:tremble:
Rider
04-05-2010, 11:33 AM
Do you follow the owner's manual schedule or just do your maintenance whenever?
I always follow the schedule except I do oil changes more frequently and on my 2 stroke dirt bikes I did not replace the top end every 25 hours as recommended.
Particle Man
04-05-2010, 03:05 PM
I always follow the schedule except I do oil changes more frequently and on my 2 stroke dirt bikes I did not replace the top end every 25 hours as recommended.
the whole freakin' top end every 25 hours?!? WTF
I planned on following the maintenance schedule. But then I rode Lucy to the beach the first week I had her and blew the initial mileage checkup.
When I came back for my 'first oil change' 2 weeks after buying the bike the guy that sold it to me asked if I was back because I wrecked. Whatever.
I do follow a loose schedule of my own. I also quiz the mechanic when I'm in to make sure I'm not forgetting something important!!
Rider
04-05-2010, 04:09 PM
the whole freakin' top end every 25 hours?!? WTF
Yeah OEM recommendation. I let my Wiseco pistons go 50 hours though.
heh i told fred this when we rode saturday but after i resurrected the 450 i rode it for about six months on the 26 year old oil. No shards at change either.
You need to check the chain on that thing, I could see and hear it flapping against the swingarm or frame or something from where I was riding. There was probably 4 to 6 inches of vertical movement in it.
Gasman, 6k miles and the forks needed to be freshened up? I suspect they might not have been assembled correctly to begin with. Unless someone is using their bike way outside its design limits (stunting) I wouldn't even think to check my forks until around 20k mi or 5 years. My last bike went 26k and I never even looked in the forks, although I did check the valves at 19k because I thought I heard a ticking, which turned out to be 1 valve at the very limit of being servicable (still good), so I adjusted it back to the middle of the recommended range and closed it back up.
I also totally agree with you that the filter will break down well before the oil does.
Really what I'm trying to get at is that if something needs constant maintenance (like a chain) then I look at it alot, if something needs periodic maintenance (oil change) then I do it when it needs getting done, and if something needs very little maintenance (forks) then I look at when it tells me to look at it. Also realize the fact that when I look at my air filter I also change out my spark plugs, if they need to be looked at or not, just because I'm already in there and it only takes a few extra minutes to get to the spark plugs. Common sense really drives my maintenance.
Keep in mind though that I'm just some dude, not an expert of any kind
And lastly yes i would stretch the service interval on the ducati's way out to 150 miles, I totally understand that the manual says you should inspect and adjust them at every stop light but I think 150 miles is close enough.
marko138
04-05-2010, 04:42 PM
You need to check the chain on that thing, I could see and hear it flapping against the swingarm or frame or something from where I was riding. There was probably 4 to 6 inches of vertical movement in it.
Gasman, 6k miles and the forks needed to be freshened up? I suspect they might not have been assembled correctly to begin with. Unless someone is using their bike way outside its design limits (stunting) I wouldn't even think to check my forks until around 20k mi or 5 years. My last bike went 26k and I never even looked in the forks, although I did check the valves at 19k because I thought I heard a ticking, which turned out to be 1 valve at the very limit of being servicable (still good), so I adjusted it back to the middle of the recommended range and closed it back up.
I also totally agree with you that the filter will break down well before the oil does.
Really what I'm trying to get at is that if something needs constant maintenance (like a chain) then I look at it alot, if something needs periodic maintenance (oil change) then I do it when it needs getting done, and if something needs very little maintenance (forks) then I look at when it tells me to look at it.
And lastly yes i would stretch the service interval on the ducati's way out to 150 miles, I totally understand that the manual says you should inspect and adjust them at every stop light but I think 150 miles is close enough.
I'm glad you'd be vigilant to explosive valves if you owned a Ducati.
I'm glad you'd be vigilant to explosive valves if you owned a Ducati.
I'm sorry, I love their bikes, they look great, sound great, ride great. I would even venture to say that they are probably great in bed too. But their maintenance is just too much for me. Everyone I know that has one is always talking about doing something to adjust or tighten or check the ellusive whochamawhatzit.
Gas Man
04-05-2010, 10:54 PM
My Bavarian master piece also has 3 that have to be changed. Motor, Tranny, and Final drive. Tranny and Final drive are the same type of oil though.
aND DO YOU CHANGE THE OILS EVERY SERVICE REGARDLESS WHAT THEY TELL YOU AT THE MOCO?
The recommended interval for a check, clean, regap, or replace on my bike's spark plugs is every 6 months or 6,000 km. I haven't been good about this and I suspect the previous owners weren't either.:tremble:
gOOD THING IS THAT ON MY BIKES i CAN DAMN NEAR CHECK THE SPARK PLUGS FROM THE RIDERS SEAT.
rEPLIES TO DERF BELOW IN BOLD
Gasman, 6k miles and the forks needed to be freshened up? I suspect they might not have been assembled correctly to begin with. Unless someone is using their bike way outside its design limits (stunting) I wouldn't even think to check my forks until around 20k mi or 5 years. My last bike went 26k and I never even looked in the forks, although I did check the valves at 19k because I thought I heard a ticking, which turned out to be 1 valve at the very limit of being servicable (still good), so I adjusted it back to the middle of the recommended range and closed it back up.
wELL WITH THE CHOPPER ITS A MATTER OF 10" LONGER THAN STOCK hd FORKS SO THERE ARE A GREAT MORE FLEX AND WEAR IN THEM.
I also totally agree with you that the filter will break down well before the oil does.
uNLESS YOU GO k&p LIKE i DO.
Keep in mind though that I'm just some dude, not an expert of any kind
aGREED AND SAME WAY FOR ME.
YEP!
Switch
04-05-2010, 10:58 PM
Caps Lock.
Gas Man
04-05-2010, 10:59 PM
yES ITS GRAND.
aND DO YOU CHANGE THE OILS EVERY SERVICE REGARDLESS WHAT THEY TELL YOU AT THE MOCO?
gOOD THING IS THAT ON MY BIKES i CAN DAMN NEAR CHECK THE SPARK PLUGS FROM THE RIDERS SEAT.
rEPLIES TO DERF BELOW IN BOLD
YEP!
yOUR CAPS LOCKS ARE ON
Gas Man
04-05-2010, 11:01 PM
yOUR CAPS LOCKS ARE ON
aWESOME!
uNLESS YOU GO k&p LIKE i DO.
I enjoy stabbing my old filters with a screw driver way too much to want to change from a paper to reusable filter
Switch
04-05-2010, 11:14 PM
I would say that a Scotts filter is well worth the investment.
Gas Man
04-05-2010, 11:20 PM
I would say that a Scotts filter is well worth the investment.
wHICH IS MADE BY k&p
aND THAT IS FOR THE BLAhDUnKAdUNK
Switch
04-06-2010, 12:18 AM
wHICH IS MADE BY k&p
I was agreeing with you, cockbag.
Gas Man
04-06-2010, 12:19 AM
i was agreeing with you, cockbag.
tHEN YOU'RE THE NUT BAG TO MY COCK! tnx!
Particle Man
04-07-2010, 10:11 AM
I enjoy stabbing my old filters with a screw driver way too much to want to change from a paper to reusable filter
It's a great stress relief, isn't it? :lol:
aND DO YOU CHANGE THE OILS EVERY SERVICE REGARDLESS WHAT THEY TELL YOU AT THE MOCO?
I change all three every 6k. I believe the tranny and final drive are 12k changes, but since it has known final drive issues, I go ahead and do it just in case. You can see if you are going to have a failure soon at least. :lol:
It's a great stress relief, isn't it? :lol:
No the stress relief is trying to set them on fire after
Particle Man
04-07-2010, 09:30 PM
No the stress relief is trying to set them on fire after
Hmmm, I'll have to try that :lol:
Hmmm, I'll have to try that :lol:
Oil isn't as easy to burn as it sounds
Particle Man
04-07-2010, 10:38 PM
Oil isn't as easy to burn as it sounds
it is when you mix it with gasoline and diesel *evilgrin*
Gas Man
04-08-2010, 12:59 AM
I change all three every 6k. I believe the tranny and final drive are 12k changes, but since it has known final drive issues, I go ahead and do it just in case. You can see if you are going to have a failure soon at least. :lol:
Right that is something similar to mine. BUt I just change all 3 every time. But I also do it twice as much as you do.
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