Great, another US war [Archive]

tallywacker

03-18-2011, 12:41 AM

The U.N. Security Council on Thursday evening voted to authorize a no-fly zone over Libya and to “take all necessary measures” - without using an occupation force - to protect civilians and population centers under the threat of attack in Libya.

Diplomats warned that action was needed to halt Libyan leader Moammar Gadhafi's rapid advances against rebel positions in his country.

The broadly worded resolution would seem to leave open the possibility that air forces implementing the no-fly zone may not only prevent Libyan military aircraft from flying, but also target Gadhafi’s wider ability to wage war.

“We’ve been told by diplomats this could certainly indeed move the door so that you have a more of a robust military approach – by the West, by Arab countries – to help the rebels and stop Col. Gadhafi from reaching Benghazi,” said CNN’s senior U.N. correspondent, Richard Roth.

“The next step is really not here anymore at the U.N. It is going to be decided elsewhere [by U.N. member states] whether there are planes flying and ships moving to counter Col. Gadhafi’s military advance,” Roth said, adding that it wasn’t clear when the establishment of the no-fly zone would happen.

Here is what Thursday’s resolution authorizes:

No-fly zone

The authorization establishes a ban on all flights in Libyan airspace to help protect civilians. The exceptions are:

– Flights by U.N. member states for the purpose of enforcing the flight ban

– Humanitarian flights (such as those delivering medical supplies, food and humanitarian workers)

– Any flights “which are deemed necessary” by nations enforcing the no-fly zone.

U.S. military officials have said that a no-fly zone would typically be enforced by fighter jets.

A no-fly zone could cost up to $300 million a week, according to data obtained by CNN’s Barbara Starr.

“Protect civilians and civilian populated areas”

In addition to the no-fly zone, the resolution authorizes member states “to take all necessary measures … to protect civilians and civilian populated areas under threat of attack in the Libyan Arab Jamahiriya, including Benghazi.”

However, the resolution prohibits "a foreign occupation force of any form on any part of Libyan territory."

Roth, reporting on CNN and CNN International, said that the exact composition of the nations that would participate wasn’t immediately clear. The Arab League's U.N. ambassador, Yahya Mahmassani, said two Arab countries would take part in a no-fly zone operation, but he was not sure which two.

U.S. Secretary of State Hillary Clinton said the United States would not act without a U.N. resolution. The United States has said it wants Arab nations to take part in no-fly zone.

Asked whether France will be involved in strikes against Libya if a resolution was passed, French Foreign Minister Alain Juppe said Thursday at the United Nations that "France is available with others to put the resolution in action, including in this domain."

Germany, one of five nations on the Security Council to abstain from Thursday’s vote, said it would not contribute any forces. The other nations that abstained from Thursday's vote were Russia, China, Brazil and India.

http://news.blogs.cnn.com/2011/03/17/what-a-no-fly-zone-other-libya-measures-would-mean/?hpt=T1

Here is the wording

http://i.cdn.turner.com/cnn/2011/images/03/17/draft.resolution.on.libya.pdf?hpt=T1

The only thing that isn't allowed is a large scale ground force. Much more than a no-fly zone. I'm tired of US service members dying for ungrateful fucks and wasting even MORE of our money that we don't have.

pauldun170

03-18-2011, 12:54 AM

This should be france's and uk's ball. Europe is the one with vital interests there and they should step up to the plate. Both countries have good pilots and capable systems to handle this. U.S. involvement should go as far as the vote approving the resolution.

derf

03-18-2011, 12:57 AM

The only thing that isn't allowed is a large scale ground force. Much more than a no-fly zone. I'm tired of US service members dying for ungrateful fucks and wasting even MORE of our money that we don't have.

Yeh except it doesnt forbid advisory, force application, direct action, or observation forces. I would be more than willing to bet there are more than a few of our troops and operatives there already

tallywacker

03-18-2011, 12:58 AM

Yeh except it doesnt forbid advisory, force application, direct action, or observation forces. I would be more than willing to bet there are more than a few of our troops and operatives there already

yeeep

Particle Man

03-18-2011, 07:49 AM

fatbuckRTO

03-18-2011, 08:49 AM

Homeslice

03-18-2011, 09:01 AM

Hmm, how long will it end up lasting? Until a new country gets carved out of Libya? :rolleyes:

pauldun170

03-18-2011, 09:08 AM

Libya declares ceasefire

http://www.washingtonpost.com/world/libya-declares-cease-fire-and-says-it-will-stop-military-operations-as-the-west-mobilizes/2011/03/18/ABijLoo_story.html

pauldun170

03-18-2011, 09:11 AM

The logic behind what seems to be a fairly popular support in the US for this no-fly zone boggles my mind. While support for Afghanistan is waning, and I won't even mention Iraq beyond mentioning it...

Who in this country supports a no-fly zone?
Last I checked it was a couple of idiot politicians and a few pundits mainly for brownie points.

Trip

03-18-2011, 09:13 AM

lol, they are chickens

fatbuckRTO

03-18-2011, 09:25 AM

Who in this country supports a no-fly zone?
"More than half of Americans" and "Bill Clinton."

http://blogs.abcnews.com/thenumbers/2011/03/support-for-a-libyan-no-fly-zone-comes-with-questions-about-the-future.html

http://www.bloomberg.com/news/2011-03-11/bill-clinton-says-u-s-should-support-a-no-fly-zone-to-help-libyan-rebels.html

From all the rhetoric I'm hearing and reading, quite a few people. In general, the ones I see are the same people who last week were crying "get out of Afghanistan!" and last year were crying "get out of Iraq!"

smileyman

03-18-2011, 09:28 AM

Reagan would have said "screw a no fly zone, cruise missile his house!"

pauldun170

03-18-2011, 09:38 AM

"More than half of Americans" and "Bill Clinton."

http://blogs.abcnews.com/thenumbers/2011/03/support-for-a-libyan-no-fly-zone-comes-with-questions-about-the-future.html

http://www.bloomberg.com/news/2011-03-11/bill-clinton-says-u-s-should-support-a-no-fly-zone-to-help-libyan-rebels.html

From all the rhetoric I'm hearing and reading, quite a few people. In general, the ones I see are the same people who last week were crying "get out of Afghanistan!" and last year were crying "get out of Iraq!"

I hate polls...you should know that. I'd have to see the questions and the way the poll was conducted. However that's not important. People are generally ignorant when it comes to things like this.
Luckily the administration has at least shown that it will be taking a different route. UK already has things in motion and I'm sure France is doing the same.
There is no need for US involvement. All that was needed was our vote on the council.

Now if only one of those righteous countries would put to vote a resolution condemning Bahrain's (including the Saudi's rolling in and shooting up protesters) crackdown.

I'd love to see how we vote on that resolution

The no-fly zone over Iraq “did not prevent Saddam Hussein from slaughtering people on the ground and it did not get him out of office,” Hillary Clinton said before a House Appropriations subcommittee.

Iraqi Kurds were kept safe from Saddam’s air force by the air blockade, which helped them develop a viable and democratic enclave there, Bill Clinton said.
Looks SOMEONE will be sleeping on the couch tonight

fatbuckRTO

03-18-2011, 10:57 AM

I hate polls...you should know that. Why would I know that? Did you vote in a poll on polls? Without empirical data, your opinion on polls is all just guesswork to me.

pauldun170

03-18-2011, 11:32 AM

Why would I know that? Did you vote in a poll on polls? Without empirical data, your opinion on polls is all just guesswork to me.

Geeez...
Scuse me for thinking you read my posts about polls back in CF days.
Cranky old jerk...

fatbuckRTO

03-18-2011, 11:36 AM

Geeez...
Scuse me for thinking you read my posts about polls back in CF days.
Cranky old jerk...Unless they were poll posts I wasn't paying attention.

If it's not a poll, it's TRIPE!!!

pauldun170

03-18-2011, 11:45 AM

Unless they were poll posts I wasn't paying attention.

If it's not a poll, it's TRIPE!!!

:nopic:

goof2

03-18-2011, 12:15 PM

I hate polls...you should know that. I'd have to see the questions and the way the poll was conducted. However that's not important. People are generally ignorant when it comes to things like this.
Luckily the administration has at least shown that it will be taking a different route. UK already has things in motion and I'm sure France is doing the same.
There is no need for US involvement. All that was needed was our vote on the council.

Now if only one of those righteous countries would put to vote a resolution condemning Bahrain's (including the Saudi's rolling in and shooting up protesters) crackdown.

I'd love to see how we vote on that resolution

At the end of the blog/post/whatever there was a link to the questions, methodology, and results for the poll. I'm not advocating for the poll, just giving you more information. I don't need you to threaten to dance naked on my lawn over a poll again.:tremble:

http://www.langerresearch.com/uploads/1121a1%20MENA%20Unrest.pdf

Looks SOMEONE will be sleeping on the couch tonight

We are talking about Bill Clinton. It is a safe bet that he sleeps on the couch a lot of nights.

pauldun170

03-18-2011, 01:09 PM

At the end of the blog/post/whatever there was a link to the questions, methodology, and results for the poll. I'm not advocating for the poll, just giving you more information. I don't need you to threaten to dance naked on my lawn over a poll again.:tremble:

http://www.langerresearch.com/uploads/1121a1%20MENA%20Unrest.pdf

We are talking about Bill Clinton. It is a safe bet that he sleeps on the couch a lot of nights.

My opinion on that poll would need its own thread.
However, a summary is provided below:
meh...lame

pauldun170

03-18-2011, 01:27 PM

http://www.bbc.co.uk/news/uk-12782642

Archren

03-18-2011, 02:42 PM

Anyone else watch the President's speech? Spidey senses tingling... he said "no ground troops", but never say never.

Brandon

03-18-2011, 07:34 PM

who else thinks the middle east is a powder keg waiting for a match?

im surprised its not worse than it is.

id agree, i bet we have guys in Libya already. now someone off that phuckstick. :skep:

KSGregman

03-18-2011, 08:57 PM

who else thinks the middle east is a powder keg waiting for a match?

im surprised its not worse than it is.

id agree, i bet we have guys in Libya already. now someone off that phuckstick. :skep:

I don't know why WE are bothering to stick our nose into ANOTHER tribal-ism infested shit hole.

The French and the Italians are responsible for the fucking disaster area that is North Africa....they are their half assed colonialism....let THEM shed some of their own blood and spend some of their own treasure to clean it up.

azoomm

03-19-2011, 11:15 AM

I don't know why WE are bothering to stick our nose into ANOTHER tribal-ism infested shit hole.

I'll take OIL for $1000...

And, it really isn't even about us getting their oil. It's about anyone but them getting their oil. The oil game isn't about who has the most, it's who is left with the most. Anyone that thinks we are dependent on Middle East oil is kidding themselves. Our reserves and future supply [Gulf, Alaska, etc.] well exceed those around us. It's more about buying off all of theirs.

:whistle:

fnfalman

03-19-2011, 02:06 PM

I wonder how many liberals are going to be running around screaming, "No War For Oil".

Particle Man

03-19-2011, 03:59 PM

I wonder how many liberals are going to be running around screaming, "No War For Oil".
Nah, they'll drive...

Kaneman

03-19-2011, 04:36 PM

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=jl2JQfxnnHU

derf

03-19-2011, 07:26 PM

Reports are saying that it has started

http://www.cnn.com/2011/WORLD/africa/03/19/libya.civil.war/index.html?hpt=T1

http://fastcache.gawkerassets.com/assets/images/12/2011/03/doomedjet.jpg

pauldun170

03-19-2011, 07:41 PM

http://www.latimes.com/news/nationworld/world/la-fg-libya-sarkozy-20110320,0,1429282.story

Reports are saying that it has started

http://www.cnn.com/2011/WORLD/africa/03/19/libya.civil.war/index.html?hpt=T1

http://fastcache.gawkerassets.com/assets/images/12/2011/03/doomedjet.jpg

I thought that happend before everything started

derf

03-19-2011, 07:55 PM

I dunno, it was a picture that said more than my words could say

pauldun170

03-19-2011, 11:47 PM

http://www.liveleak.com/view?i=ccc_1300563244

derf

03-20-2011, 12:00 AM

So which side was shooting the AA guns at the planes? Was it Lybian or opposition pulling the trigger?

fnfalman

03-20-2011, 01:05 AM

I wonder how many liberals are out there yapping, "No War For Oil", or "Unjustified War" now that Obama was the one that got involved?

Fucking bunch of hypocrites.

pauldun170

03-20-2011, 01:14 AM

I wonder how many liberals are going to be running around screaming, "No War For Oil".

I wonder how many liberals are out there yapping, "No War For Oil", or "Unjustified War" now that Obama was the one that got involved?

Fucking bunch of hypocrites.

Are you just going to keep posting that over and over?

You could probably save some time by making it your signature or something.
Its a little awkward otherwise...

fnfalman

03-20-2011, 03:39 AM

Are you just going to keep posting that over and over?

You could probably save some time by making it your signature or something.
Its a little awkward otherwise...

Why?

The libtards had been whining about No War for Oil for the last umpteenth years even though Dubya is now well out of the Oval Office.

I figure I can do the same for a bit.

Kaneman

03-20-2011, 10:14 AM

Why?

The libtards had been whining about No War for Oil for the last umpteenth years even though Dubya is now well out of the Oval Office.

I figure I can do the same for a bit.

So you're contending that oil has nothing to do with why the US invades foreign countries? Or you know it does and you think those with the most advanced weapons should get the most oil?

pauldun170

03-20-2011, 11:16 AM

Why?

The libtards had been whining about No War for Oil for the last umpteenth years even though Dubya is now well out of the Oval Office.

I figure I can do the same for a bit.

I'm just saying you could save time.

Damn old people...doing computer stuff all awkwardly.

udman

03-20-2011, 12:04 PM

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=OY-_JsNrxiM

Homeslice

03-20-2011, 12:46 PM

Of course, you guys realize we get less than 1% of our oil from Libya....

We get more from the freaking Virgin Islands than we get from Libya.

And you want to blame Obama......... well I recall that Libya was on a list of 5-6 countries that the Pentagon proposed invading after 9/11. No doubt Bush, Cheney and Rumsfeld seriously considered it.........Hell, Rumsfeld probably thought he could accomplish them all in 6 months. :lol: Talk about delusional.

pauldun170

03-20-2011, 01:12 PM

Of course, you guys realize we get less than 1% of our oil from Libya....

We get more from the freaking Virgin Islands than we get from Libya.

I also recall that Libya was on a list of 5-6 other countries that the Pentagon proposed invading after 9/11. No doubt Bush, Cheney and Rumsfeld seriously considered it.........Hell, Rumsfeld probably thought he could accomplish them all in 6 months. :lol: Talk about delusional.

Its not even comparable.

This is something pushed by the French. They got UK along for the ride. The arab league was supportive of the action (though not anymore now that it has gone beyond the initial no fly zone).
We are along for the ride because were asked to support the initial ops and we have the best capability for some of the things required.
The French and the British just need to work out the details on who handles what and we should be able to step back to a more minor role.

fatbuckRTO

03-20-2011, 04:51 PM

Its not even comparable.

This is something pushed by the French. They got UK along for the ride. The arab league was supportive of the action (though not anymore now that it has gone beyond the initial no fly zone).
We are along for the ride because were asked to support the initial ops and we have the best capability for some of the things required.
The French and the British just need to work out the details on who handles what and we should be able to step back to a more minor role.

Quoted for evidence.

It's a military operation. The French are spearheading it. There is a UN mandate. The US is involved in a minor or support capacity.

I'll let someone else connect the dots...

pauldun170

03-20-2011, 06:35 PM

Quoted for evidence.

It's a military operation. The French are spearheading it. There is a UN mandate. The US is involved in a minor or support capacity.

I'll let someone else connect the dots...

You pay attention to post liike that but youi ignore my rants about polls?
You got issues

pauldun170

03-20-2011, 07:24 PM

http://www.aolnews.com/2011/03/20/gates-us-expects-to-hand-off-libya-lead-in-days/

tallywacker

03-20-2011, 09:26 PM

Well the arab league is condemning the bombing now, and russia said it would vote no now on the action.

Also, all of the fighting is from the USA again, with over 140 cruise missiles launched so far.

pauldun170

03-20-2011, 09:55 PM

Also, all of the fighting is from the USA again, with over 140 cruise missiles launched so far.

Except for the Cruise missiles launched by the UK and the French whose planes fired the first shots and pretty much dropping lulz on em since then. Couple of British planes in the air....but they are British so all they are really doing is making jokes about "paki's" or something.

The US launched a bunch of shit and we knocked out a bunch of shit but are now taking a break to enjoy the relaxed rules on gay sex.

In other words...no. We are not doing all the fighting.

tallywacker

03-20-2011, 10:02 PM

Except for the Cruise missiles launched by the UK and the French whose planes fired the first shots and pretty much dropping lulz on em since then. Couple of British planes in the air....but they are British so all they are really doing is making jokes about "paki's" or something.

The US launched a bunch of shit and we knocked out a bunch of shit but are now taking a break to enjoy the relaxed rules on gay sex.

In other words...no. We are not doing all the fighting.

But we are doing most of the fighting, instead we shouldn't even be involved. 64 million dollars gone in tomahawk cruise missiles BOOM gone. That doesn't even count the logistical costs of another conflict with no end in sight.

At the same time we are talking about making our military go without pay, laying off teachers, and *insert in troubled underfunded program here*
Our own country is near financial ruin, yet we are still spending money like a 16 yr old rich girl with her daddies credit card.

derf

03-20-2011, 10:14 PM

yet we are still spending money like a 16 yr old rich girl with her daddies credit card.

Are we at least a hot girl? Can we sext ourselfs?

Captain Morgan

03-20-2011, 10:17 PM

At the same time we are talking about making our military go without pay...

the military won't go without pay. A lot of non-essential government employees may get put on leave without pay for awhile, but the military will be considered "essential"

tallywacker

03-20-2011, 10:19 PM

the military won't go without pay. A lot of non-essential government employees may get put on leave without pay for awhile, but the military will be considered "essential"

If government shuts down, so would troop pay

By Rick Maze - Staff writer
Posted : Friday Mar 11, 2011 12:08:58 EST

U.S. troops could be required to report to work without pay if a budget clash in Congress results in a government-wide shutdown, according to draft planning guidance circulating in the Pentagon.

A shutdown could happen as early as next week, as the government is set to run out of money at midnight March 17. A bill that would keep the government operating temporarily has been prepared in the House of Representatives, but it is not clear when or if it might pass.

The government has been operating under a series of temporary appropriations, known as continuing resolutions, since Oct. 1 because of lawmakers’ inability to agree on how much money to provide federal agencies. Budget discussions have become increasingly complicated since the November general elections resulted in a divided legislature, with Republicans controlling the House and Democrats controlling the Senate.

When the government was shut down in 1995, military personnel continued to report to work and were paid, but the planning guidance sent to the services and defense agencies says a shutdown this time will be different.

“All military personnel will continue in normal duty status regardless of their affiliation with exempt or non-exempt activities,” says the draft planning guidance that was prepared for the services and defense agencies. “Military personnel will serve without pay until such time as Congress makes appropriated funds available to compensate them for this period of service.”
Discuss

• Possible pay stoppage

Troops would miss a payday only if the shutdown continues through April 1.

Defense civilian workers would be divided into two categories. “Essential” employees would be required to report to work even though they will not be paid; “nonessential” employees would be furloughed, according to the memo.

Troops and essential civilians who report for work without pay would receive back pay when government funding is restored. But whether furloughed civilians would receive back pay could depend on whether Congress specifically authorizes that, according to congressional aides who have been doing their own shutdown planning.

The memo, prepared in early March but never formally issued as guidance, attempts to spell out what defense missions would shut down and what would stay open in the event funding stops.

• Military operations in Iraq and Afghanistan will continue, including preparations for any units scheduled for deployment.

• Operations necessary for national security, safety of human life and protection of property will continue, but operations that don’t meet one of those three criteria will be “shut down in an orderly and deliberate fashion.”

• Recruiting offices, processing centers and basic training will remain operational.

• Emergency repairs and maintenance that cannot be deferred will be done on base facilities and housing.

• Medical and dental facilities will remain open, although elective surgery and procedures will be postponed. Suicide, substance abuse counseling and crisis intervention will continue.

• Dependents schools and education centers for service members will be open for use by private agencies for courses for which payment already has been made.

• Dining halls, gyms and child care centers will stay open.

• Base exchanges may remain open because they operate using nonappropriated funds. But commissaries, which are supported by taxpayer funds, may be closed, although the memo says military personnel might be assigned to replace furloughed civilians so the grocery stores could remain open.

Could have happened

tallywacker

03-20-2011, 10:22 PM

Are we at least a hot girl? Can we sext ourselfs?

That's a requirement

pauldun170

03-20-2011, 10:58 PM

But we are doing most of the fighting, instead we shouldn't even be involved. 64 million dollars gone in tomahawk cruise missiles BOOM gone. That doesn't even count the logistical costs of another conflict with no end in sight.

At the same time we are talking about making our military go without pay, laying off teachers, and *insert in troubled underfunded program here*
Our own country is near financial ruin, yet we are still spending money like a 16 yr old rich girl with her daddies credit card.

I dont think it really matters what I tell you.
however I will add this:

Chris Knight: Kent puts his name on his license plate.
Mitch: My mom does the same thing to my underwear.
Chris Knight: Your mom puts license plates in your underwear? How do you sit?

tallywacker

03-20-2011, 11:19 PM

I dont think it really matters what I tell you.
however I will add this:

Chris Knight: Kent puts his name on his license plate.
Mitch: My mom does the same thing to my underwear.
Chris Knight: Your mom puts license plates in your underwear? How do you sit?

What did you try to say in there first place? Down playing the US role even though Africa command is leading the assault, tons of money is being sunk for no gain, we are portrayed as civilian murders again by foreign media without cause, and risking lives that don't need to be risked.

The end result is what? Another theocracy more unstable than the previous dictator or worse.

How about we stay the fuck away from these bullshit operations and everyone is happy except for a few whiny Muslims that will cry if we help because we are "reckless murders" or if we don't help, thus being accused of not supporting "Freedom" . Fuck them.

derf

03-20-2011, 11:27 PM

Could have happened

That was taken from an obscure Airforce thinktank that gave a what-if-worst-case scenario based on what the government is allowed to do. It has come up in teh past and I'm sure it will come up in the future. But no the gov will not require people to show up for work and not get paid, any essential employee must show for work and recieve compensation unless there is no other way, basically the ruskies are coming, there is no money left and its an all or nothing battle.

pauldun170

03-20-2011, 11:31 PM

What did you try to say in there first place? Down playing the US role even though Africa command is leading the assault, tons of money is being sunk for no gain, we are portrayed as civilian murders again by foreign media without cause, and risking lives that don't need to be risked.

The end result is what? Another theocracy more unstable than the previous dictator or worse.

How about we stay the fuck away from these bullshit operations and everyone is happy except for a few whiny Muslims that will cry if we help because we are "reckless murders" or if we don't help, thus being accused of not supporting "Freedom" . Fuck them.

Angry tallywacker is angry

tallywacker

03-20-2011, 11:39 PM

Angry tallywacker is angry

Sure I am, I just wish more people would be as well. This nation and it's governance is a fucking mess.

I wouldn't be as mad if I didn't know first hand how much money is wasted during "wartime" and just disappears. Contractors getting paid to do nothing or shitty work, then pay the same to do it over again. Buying brand new dualie turbo diesel F-350's for officers/contractors/civilians to cruise around the green zone and LSA Anaconda in.

Then don't get me started on the bribe money we paid the locals so they wouldn't bomb us anymore. Sons of Iraq garbage only worked because they got paid well to just to sit on the side of the road with an AK. It was like the US Army paying protection money to the mafia or else they would plant IED's if we didn't.

101lifts2

03-20-2011, 11:39 PM

I belive in a non-interventionist government when it comes to foreign affairs that do not directly affect us.

But apparently corporations who bank off of it do not. Unfortunate.

pauldun170

03-20-2011, 11:42 PM

Sure I am, I just wish more people would be as well. This nation and it's governance is a fucking mess.

I wouldn't be as mad if I didn't know first hand how much money is wasted during "wartime" and just disappears. Contractors getting paid to do nothing or shitty work, then pay the same to do it over again. Buying brand new dualie turbo diesel F-350's for officers/contractors/civilians to cruise around the green zone and LSA Anaconda in.

Then don't get me started on the bribe money we paid the locals so they wouldn't bomb us anymore. Sons of Iraq garbage only worked because they got paid well to just to sit on the side of the road with an AK. It was like the US Army paying protection money to the mafia or else they would plant IED's if we didn't.

I'm not angry.
I hope that doesn't make you angry that I'm not angry because even though that wouldn't make me angry it would make me cock my eyebrow just a lil bit.

tallywacker

03-20-2011, 11:53 PM

I'm not angry.
I hope that doesn't make you angry that I'm not angry because even though that wouldn't make me angry it would make me cock my eyebrow just a lil bit.

:dn:

fatbuckRTO

03-21-2011, 12:54 AM

You pay attention to post liike that but youi ignore my rants about polls?
You got issues

I just want someone to blame when the whole thing goes south. Congrats, scapegoat170!

pauldun170

03-21-2011, 01:10 AM

I just want someone to blame when the whole thing goes south. Congrats, scapegoat170!

:lol

If my posts on the subject are going to be used against me in future threads I really should pay more attention to grammar and spelling.

I want them to at least look nice when they are dug up and linked too.

101lifts2

03-21-2011, 01:36 AM

Papa_Complex

03-21-2011, 08:43 AM

So where is the 'no fly zone' for Bahrain?

pauldun170

03-21-2011, 09:28 AM

So where is the 'no fly zone' for Bahrain?

1. There is only 8 people in Bahrain. The other 1,000,000 people who live there are hired actors. One misplaced bomb could wipe out the who population.
2. Saudi's are doing the no fly zone except they are not using planes. They sent security forces to walk around making airplane sounds while they beat protesters with shotgun barrels and bullets.

Archren

03-21-2011, 09:32 AM

I wouldn't be as mad if I didn't know first hand how much money is wasted during "wartime" and just disappears. Contractors getting paid to do nothing or shitty work, then pay the same to do it over again. Buying brand new dualie turbo diesel F-350's for officers/contractors/civilians to cruise around the green zone and LSA Anaconda in.

Having worked in Engineering and Contracting ops downrange this last deployment... this assessment is spot on. We had a requirement of giving local contractors the option of doing construction for us.. yeah, it was cheaper than KBR or even RED HORSE, but their work was fucking crap. RED HORSE could put down a concrete pad in a few hours and make it look like a fucking work of art. LN contractor puts a similar concrete pad down and makes it look like he took a shit instead - pad was cracked before it was even fully cured. And then the assholes who we had to deal with for bringing in gravel... that was highway robbery right there. But that's an entirely different rant.

And bird Colonels should have to ride the fucking bus back to their CHUs just like the rest of us. DILLIGAF that you are a brigade commander? You already get your own shower and shitter while the rest of us have to walk a block for the same thing every morning. Leave the vehicles where the people who actually do some work can use them.

Papa_Complex

03-21-2011, 09:34 AM

1. There is only 8 people in Bahrain. The other 1,000,000 people who live there are hired actors. One misplaced bomb could wipe out the who population.
2. Saudi's are doing the no fly zone except they are not using planes. They sent security forces to walk around making airplane sounds while they beat protesters with shotgun barrels and bullets.

You mean....

fatbuckRTO

03-21-2011, 10:57 AM

So where is the 'no fly zone' for Bahrain?

Having been to Bahrain a couple times, I'm still stuck on the question "WTF is there to protest about?"

Papa_Complex

03-21-2011, 11:00 AM

Having been to Bahrain a couple times, I'm still stuck on the question "WTF is there to protest about?"

Whatever it is, it's apparently worth killing a few hundred people over too.

KSGregman

03-21-2011, 11:23 AM

Having been to Bahrain a couple times, I'm still stuck on the question "WTF is there to protest about?"

Bahrain is a monarchy.....the "royal" family is Sunni Muslim....the vast majority of people in Bahrain are Shia Muslims and are FIERCELY discriminated against. The majority who are being persecuted because of their religion....denied education...denied access to decent jobs...have had enough.

Want to know why Saudi Arabia built a bridge to Bahrain? It certainly wasn't to support a tourist industry....it was because if those dirty Shia bastards ever decided to act up....right on the doorstep of the heart of Sunni Muslim-ism they wanted a fast track to get there and kick ass....which is EXACTLY what you are seeing in Bahrain today.

http://www.bahrainrights.org/node/29

fatbuckRTO

03-21-2011, 11:45 AM

Want to know why Saudi Arabia built a bridge to Bahrain? It certainly wasn't to support a tourist industry....it was because if those dirty Shia bastards ever decided to act up....right on the doorstep of the heart of Sunni Muslim-ism they wanted a fast track to get there and kick ass....which is EXACTLY what you are seeing in Bahrain today.
Meh. So the question of who to support in Bahrain really becomes "Who do you want to see discriminated against most?" Because if and when the Shias are in control you can count on an instant replay against Sunnis.

Right off the top of my head, I'd say "no one," which is who we should be supporting in Libya too. I guarantee whoever comes out ahead will turn right around and bite whatever western hands are in range.

KSGregman

03-21-2011, 11:55 AM

Meh. So the question of who to support in Bahrain really becomes "Who do you want to see discriminated against most?" Because if and when the Shias are in control you can count on an instant replay against Sunnis.

Right off the top of my head, I'd say "no one," which is who we should be supporting in Libya too. I guarantee whoever comes out ahead will turn right around and bite whatever western hands are in range.

I didn't and don't express an opinion about who is right or wrong....anyone using "religion" to justify aggression/killing/murder/war is beyond hope anyway.

Add in the tribal-ism that still plagues that part of the world and you have a REAL shit hole.

Papa_Complex

03-21-2011, 12:04 PM

I didn't and don't express an opinion about who is right or wrong....anyone using "religion" to justify aggression/killing/murder/war is beyond hope anyway.

Add in the tribal-ism that still plagues that part of the world and you have a REAL shit hole.

Religion is rarely the reason, but rather the excuse. The reasons are invariably political and financial.

Homeslice

03-21-2011, 05:56 PM

I wouldn't be as mad if I didn't know first hand how much money is wasted during "wartime" and just disappears. Contractors getting paid to do nothing or shitty work, then pay the same to do it over again. .

Or causing people to die of electrocution in the shower, as happened to at least 12 soldiers in Iraq, due to shoddy construction work by KBR and equally shoddy oversight by military officers

Archren

03-21-2011, 06:04 PM

Or causing people to die of electrocution in the shower, as happened to at least 12 soldiers in Iraq, due to shoddy construction work by KBR and equally shoddy oversight by military officers

Which then causes more money to be spent when TF Safe has to go in and tell KBR to fix all the shoddy electrical work.

pauldun170

03-29-2011, 09:50 AM

http://www.msnbc.msn.com/id/42311273/ns/politics/

The United States will continue to handle tasks such as intelligence gathering and search-and-rescue operations for downed pilots.

Dave

03-29-2011, 11:02 AM

Having worked in Engineering and Contracting ops downrange this last deployment... this assessment is spot on. We had a requirement of giving local contractors the option of doing construction for us.. yeah, it was cheaper than KBR or even RED HORSE, but their work was fucking crap. RED HORSE could put down a concrete pad in a few hours and make it look like a fucking work of art. LN contractor puts a similar concrete pad down and makes it look like he took a shit instead - pad was cracked before it was even fully cured. And then the assholes who we had to deal with for bringing in gravel... that was highway robbery right there. But that's an entirely different rant.

And bird Colonels should have to ride the fucking bus back to their CHUs just like the rest of us. DILLIGAF that you are a brigade commander? You already get your own shower and shitter while the rest of us have to walk a block for the same thing every morning. Leave the vehicles where the people who actually do some work can use them.

My last trip we were trying to get someone at home to mail us a fuckton of blue food coloring that we were gonna dump into some random officer's shower water supply. Never happened though.

Archren

03-29-2011, 12:23 PM

My last trip we were trying to get someone at home to mail us a fuckton of blue food coloring that we were gonna dump into some random officer's shower water supply. Never happened though.

THAT would have been an epic win. Fuck it, I'd say mail food coloring to a buddy in Iraq.. the rate we're deploying, I'm sure someone can pull it off sooner or later. Hell, I have a buddy in Iraq right now that might just do it... :D

AquaPython

03-29-2011, 01:49 PM

not food coloring, toilet water coloring, aka 2000 flushes. you just put one tablet in the shower head

Papa_Complex

03-29-2011, 02:06 PM

not food coloring, toilet water coloring, aka 2000 flushes. you just put one tablet in the shower head

I see that you've done this before :lol:

Dave

03-29-2011, 02:07 PM

not food coloring, toilet water coloring, aka 2000 flushes. you just put one tablet in the shower head

That requires me gaining access to their hooch. Not outside my skillset but far more difficult than popping open their supply tank. Harder to get away with too

Archren

03-29-2011, 02:49 PM

That requires me gaining access to their hooch. Not outside my skillset but far more difficult than popping open their supply tank. Harder to get away with too

I was on the health & welfare inspection team. I could have gotten access... just would have needed the 1SG to cover my alibi. :lol:

fatbuckRTO

03-31-2011, 04:55 PM

I love how the administration and the news are making such a huge deal about NATO taking over command of the air operations. Since when has a military operation being run by NATO meant the US actually takes a lesser role? Historically all it has meant is that US troops no longer get to answer to a US chain-of-command.

Brilliant!

tallywacker

04-04-2011, 09:15 PM

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ClGCS4OeqVM

Must watch video, he really tells that CNN bitch whats up at the end. Finally some truth about the situation.

Papa_Complex

04-05-2011, 06:30 AM

Papa_Complex

04-05-2011, 06:37 AM

Must watch video, he really tells that CNN bitch whats up at the end. Finally some truth about the situation.

I would have to say that using the word "bankrupt" is definitely over stating the case. An unnecessary expenditure? Absolutely.

pauldun170

04-05-2011, 12:32 PM

Meh

If you are going to get a spook to come on network news at least get the entertaining ones....not the grumpy old "I got this email forward and it made me so mad!!" types.

Like this one for example...
http://gawker.com/#!5788918/woman-who-attacked-painting-is-totally-sane-cia-agent

Papa_Complex

04-05-2011, 12:45 PM

The CIA has seriously gone downhill. Since The Bloc fell, the Russians have been doing far better at creating marketable spies.

http://www.thesun.co.uk/sol/homepage/news/3035268/Sexy-Russian-spy-used-Wi-Fi-for-secrets.html

KSGregman

04-05-2011, 12:57 PM

pauldun170

04-05-2011, 02:03 PM

This isn't even the HALF of it.....Michael Scheur is NOT a reactionary or stupid man....read his books.

Start with this one:

http://www.amazon.com/Imperial-Hubris-West-Losing-Terror/dp/1574888498/ref=sr_1_3?ie=UTF8&s=books&qid=1302022243&sr=1-3

This is his latest:

http://www.amazon.com/Osama-Bin-Laden-Michael-Scheuer/dp/0199738661/ref=sr_1_1?ie=UTF8&s=books&qid=1302022315&sr=1-1

He understands the mess we have created for ourselves in the Islamic world in ways that our "leaders" are not willing to discuss publicly. If more Americans would pay attention to people like him and less attention to Dancing with the Stars or American Idol we'd ALL be better off for it.....stop being distracted and seduced by the "bread and circus" constantly being fed to us and WAKE UP.

The problem with Michael Scheur, is that despite his expertise on the subject of the middle east...he has a problem of keeping his personal opinion on things unrelated to the middle east in check.

Example: "The Chinese are very close to producing a suitable homegrown engine for their J-11 aircraft but have suffered major setbacks due to production issues in Waohang province...which recently experienced political unrest. It is expected that in 5 years time, they will have overcome quality issues experienced in the first production batch and will field 12 examples within striking distance of Taiwan. To bad we will be unable to do anything about it because of these damn Mexicans keep crossing the border and collecting our social security. Maybe if Obama would just show us a birth certificate and grow some balls we wouldn't have to worry but instead we'll just sell the whole country to china to pay off our debt."

Writing good books? Happy cats...
Old man go off on a rant during an interview? Disappointing...

Michael Scheur:"The only chance we have as a country right now is for Osama bin Laden to deploy and detonate a major weapon in the United States"

Writing a thought provoking book doesn't make you a winner nor does it mean that everything that comes out of your mouth should be taken as some sort of gospel.