Official report - MotoGP racing sucks (in terms of competitiveness)

[L8 Braker]

So, we talk a lot about the lack of close racing in MotoGP...Well, I was reading THIS ARTICLE (http://moto-racing.speedtv.com/article/motogp-noyes-notebook-the-missing-ingredient-pt-i/), and this stat just blew my mind...

To this date, there have been 78 races in MotoGP using the 800cc bikes...Of all those races, 8 of them have been decided by one second or less :2eek

The writer of that article sites some possible reasons..
--the riders are as talented as ever, but it's the bikes that tether said talent
--Rossi is quoted as saying "With the 500s and even with the 990s you could come back from a mistake or a bad start, but with these 800s it is impossible. The bike’s limits are your limits"
--Rossi and Lorenzo have been speaking about how you can’t really make up for your bikes deficiencies...Try to push beyond those limits and your crash
--the two-stroke engines were not tethered by electronics... The only control over fuel delivery was in the wrist of the rider, not some complex of sensors and circuits
--the tires of old, good on the opening laps, lost grip and were prone to breaking loose over the final third of the race

So, I guess there's proof in the pudding that GP just dosen't have very competitive races often with these 800cc bikes...There aren't those races that we talk about again and again where the the race was won at the finish line instead of turn one of the race...

So, bring on the big bore engines, it's clearly time for a change...

[Dave]

those fucking bridgestones need to go for a tire that won't kill you unless its 100% warm

[KSGregman]

And get rid of traction control.....

3/4 of the grid wouldn't be able to ride in that class if not for the electronic aids. It's embarrassing.....like training wheels.

[Dave]

let's not mention the lack of practice time. The bans just keep rookies from having a hope in hell of being competitive for at least a year and a half after moving up. Add in the one and done nature of the gp career and I'm surprised anyone WANTS to race there

[smileyman]

The series has always been a technical engineering exercise since we are dealing with racing prototypes. Build the better mousetrap and you get it to work to the conditions, then collect the trophy.

What made it different was that in the olden days men had to control the two stroke beasts without rider aids. Not everyone had the touch and the smoothness to do what the machine needed done. Even then there were moments that only physics was in control.

Fast forward and the game is the same only now with rider aids the required skill has been removed from doing the magic from the seat to doing the magic in practice while setting up the bike. Yes the rider needs a special skill set but the machine has become the predominent factor. Make that machine the fastest machine and lap it at the maximum pace it will run for 20-30 laps.

Fail to run it at that pace and inside those parameters and you lose regardless of your actual riding skill. The only chance for a different result is whom Simoncelli runs into.

Formula One Racing in the modern era 1990s and up, has always suffered this problem...

[Dave]

The series has always been a technical engineering exercise since we are dealing with racing prototypes. Build the better mousetrap and you get it to work to the conditions, then collect the trophy.

What made it different was that in the olden days men had to control the two stroke beasts without rider aids. Not everyone had the touch and the smoothness to do what the machine needed done. Even then there were moments that only physics was in control.

Fast forward and the game is the same only now with rider aids the required skill has been removed from doing the magic from the seat to doing the magic in practice while setting up the bike. Yes the rider needs a special skill set but the machine has become the predominent factor. Make that machine the fastest machine and lap it at the maximum pace it will run for 20-30 laps.

Fail to run it at that pace and inside those parameters and you lose regardless of your actual riding skill. The only chance for a different result is whom Simoncelli runs into.

Formula One Racing in the modern era 1990s and up, has always suffered this problem...

F1 needs to go back to 1.5L turbo 4's

[Dave]

The series has always been a technical engineering exercise since we are dealing with racing prototypes. Build the better mousetrap and you get it to work to the conditions, then collect the trophy.

What made it different was that in the olden days men had to control the two stroke beasts without rider aids. Not everyone had the touch and the smoothness to do what the machine needed done. Even then there were moments that only physics was in control.

Fast forward and the game is the same only now with rider aids the required skill has been removed from doing the magic from the seat to doing the magic in practice while setting up the bike. Yes the rider needs a special skill set but the machine has become the predominent factor. Make that machine the fastest machine and lap it at the maximum pace it will run for 20-30 laps.

Fail to run it at that pace and inside those parameters and you lose regardless of your actual riding skill. The only chance for a different result is whom Simoncelli runs into.

Formula One Racing in the modern era 1990s and up, has always suffered this problem...

F1 needs to go back to 1.5L turbos

[anthonyk]

F1 needs to go back to 1.5L turbos

They're going to 1.6L turbos in 2014, right?

[smileyman]

Prototype racing will always have a better mousetrap. Someone will engineer an edge so the test will be the machine and not the man. On the other hand we will always have proddy racing too, where control tires and limited changes to the OEM make for a test of a man's skill. Tighter racing and usually larger grids...

I say watch them both and enjoy the drama.

BTW if motorcycle racing ever gets TV production values like F1...We'll have a great show!

[Dave]

They're going to 1.6L turbos in 2014, right?

Hadn't heard that, I stopped paying attention when they limited them to ten cylinders. Awesome news if true.

[anthonyk]

Yep, here's the article I saw about the F1 engine change:

http://news.bbc.co.uk/sport2/hi/formula_one/13878359.stm

[Dave]

Yep, here's the article I saw about the F1 engine change:

http://news.bbc.co.uk/sport2/hi/formula_one/13878359.stm


Ugh fixed configuration and forced use of hybrid greenthink. I take it back. And what's this 750 limit shit? In the 1.5t era the cars made 900 race day and 1500 in qual

[KSGregman]

Ugh fixed configuration and forced use of hybrid greenthink. I take it back. And what's this 750 limit shit? In the 1.5t era the cars made 900 race day and 1500 in qual


Yeah...and Aryton Sena flogged the shit out of that beast of a Honda (or Lotus) one handed through the streets of Monaco. Back in the days when real MEN drove real CARS....and RACED....instead of riding around in a fucking parade.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=VF3yEFbGpcs&playnext=1&list=PLD677A8A9210B8B88


I'm telling you...this obssession with technology...rather than RACING...is bullshit. Sure, the engineers are all creaming themselves ovah their latest technological marvel...but the RACING sucks balls.

[smileyman]

Could go completely the other way and suck balls tho, as NASCAR proves every weekend. Same gearing, same basic chassis, shock and spring rules, aero template rules, engine rules, spec tire, spec fuel, 1960s technology and still no real excitement?

[Dave]

Could go completely the other way and suck balls tho, as NASCAR proves every weekend. Same gearing, same basic chassis, shock and spring rules, aero template rules, engine rules, spec tire, spec fuel, 1960s technology and still no real excitement?

Nascar can get fixed in two moves. Ready? More road courses, homogolaton rules. Just like the old days. Run race prepped street cars.

Done

[Trip]

NASCAR would have to make considerably less money to ever do something that drastic. MotoGP would also have to do the same for them to change it.

[smileyman]

Nascar can get fixed in two moves. Ready? More road courses, homogolaton rules. Just like the old days. Run race prepped street cars.

Done

I would be all over that. Get rid of alot of those almost identical 1.5 mile tri ovals, run Road America, Road Atlanta, Maybe Miller, Throw in a Mexican and Canadian round...

I seriously doubt that they could run street based cars as only the Charger/ Challenger, Mustang, Camaro have the beans. Toyota would be out in left field. All sports cars when they want sedans. Cadillac would have an entry with the CTSV tho..

In the end Trip is right. No way NASCAR will abandon those big ovals because of the markets and money they rake in and no one wants a 50 race schedule....

I watch about about 6-8 NASCAR races a year, Watkins Glen and Infineon, Richmond, Martinsville, and Bristol, Talledega and Daytona. With the all star race in Charlotte as a fave due to the format.