Rip Baby Viff....

[Porkchop]

So I am now currently bikeless again. I think the babycepter took its final breath as a whole bike. She went in the shop to get new tires, a new battery, and to check on the carbs. I got a Voicemail today from my guy saying very bluntly "call me, we need to talk about your bike." Apparently before they dug into it too much, they ran some compression tests and its not good. They decided to stop and not tear it apart before they asked me but he suspects that some rings aren't seated. He doesn't think it threw something because it has never made any suspect noises. But they noticed some rust on the heads which lead him to believe the engine may have sat without carbs for a period of time. Both him, who is the service manager, and their top technician both told me it was done. They don't know if they could find parts, and generally its just not worth it.

So rip Viff, ill miss that sweet v4 purr..... :cry:

[azoomm]

Did I miss something? You took your bike in for some normal maintenance and come to find out the motor is punted. There was no symptom?

*shock*

Wow, that sucks...

[askmrjesus]

Find the manual and tear it apart yourself.

You have nothing to lose at this point, and I'm calling bullshit on "no parts available". It's a fucking Honda, the parts exist.

JC

[Porkchop]

Zoomie, the only symptom I saw was it was bogging down and not wanting to rev below 4k rpm, and some smoke when it was cold and idling with the choke on. I just attributed that to it being old. And it didn't look like oil smoke....

Jesus, not sure I want to invest that much work or money into a 26 year old bike that has a known track record of frying the cams due to top end oiling problems. And a track record of the motor bombing if you are riding a little too spirited. It may just be time to let her go and get with the times. I have been wanting to buy a sv650 trackbike anyway. People are already salivating for parts over at vfrworld.

[defector]

Find the manual and tear it apart yourself.

You have nothing to lose at this point, and I'm calling bullshit on "no parts available". It's a fucking Honda, the parts exist.

JC
1 billion percent truth.

[Dave]

Find the manual and tear it apart yourself.

You have nothing to lose at this point, and I'm calling bullshit on "no parts available". It's a fucking Honda, the parts exist.

JC

seriously. bike bandit is listing almost all the engine parts. buy some rings and a bottle hone.

[Rangerscott]

Did I miss something? You took your bike in for some normal maintenance and come to find out the motor is punted. There was no symptom?

*shock*

Wow, that sucks...


The stock engine I had in my vehicle only had two rings loose while all the others were stuck. All four pistons averaged 130 psi compression. 199 is new and 160 is service time. My engine used some oil, but ran just fine. Of course there are a lot of guys that run their engines even lower while offroading anf the engine just chugs along.

[derf]

I'll take it, even give you current value for a 30 year old non running bike, minus shipping costa if course

[Avatard]

Really dude. Hone, rings. Not exactly rocket surgery.

[RedRider2k2]

You're going to give up on a running bike because someone told you to?

At least run your own compression test.

[Porkchop]

Really dude. Hone, rings. Not exactly rocket surgery.

We don't even know what is wrong yet. He was just guessing. That is why I'm going in tomorrow to talk to them in person and look through stuff.

Though, I already have a guy wanting to take the engine and cosmetics, another guy to take the rolling chassis and title, and another to take the carbs.

[Porkchop]

You're going to give up on a running bike because someone told you to?

At least run your own compression test.

It wasn't running when it left my house. It had what I thought was carb problems, which apparently are compression problems. Its been running and non running, running and non running for a year now.

Wait.... didn't you sell one of these because you wanted something that was more reliable???

[askmrjesus]

We don't even know what is wrong yet. He was just guessing. That is why I'm going in tomorrow to talk to them in person and look through stuff.

Though, I already have a guy wanting to take the engine and cosmetics, another guy to take the rolling chassis and title, and another to take the carbs.

It's the "just guessing" part that bothers me.

I ran my own shop for several years, and I can't tell you how many guys would show up with a bike that was pronounced D.O.A by a dealership, only to find out that I could have it running in two days.

The thing is, a lot of shops don't want to fuck with old bikes. Partly, because they don't think you're going to want (or be able to) spend what it will take to fix the thing at a shop rate of $45.00 an hour or more. The other reason? They're lazy, and it's a hell of a lot easier to do brake jobs and oil changes, than it is to actually fix something. Profit, of course, also figures into this equation.

So, back to your bike- Lack of compression is caused one or two reasons (or a combination of one and two) bad rings or bad valves.

The first thing I would ask, would be the results of the compression test. What's the spec compression supposed to be, vs. was the reading was? If it's within 25% of where it's supposed to be, that's usually just normal wear.

Bad rings, as previously noted, is not too big of a deal, unless the cylinders are so far gone that they need to be re-bored. Unfortunately, there's no way to know that without tearing it down, inspecting for pits, and mic-ing the bore to see if it falls within spec. You probably don't have a micrometer that will do that, but a local machine shop could do the measuring for you, for not much dough.

Checking the valves is actually relatively simple. Pull the heads off, and yank the camshafts. All the valves are now, or should be, in the closed position. Place the head on a bench and level it with the combustion chambers upward. Fill the chambers with alcohol. Go to bed. Wake up, and see if the alcohol is still there. Yes? Good. No? Bad. 50% of the valve issues I've dealt with, were caused by carbon build up (caused by putting around at low RPM's). Simply cleaning up the valves and the seats will cure this. If the valves still leak after cleaning, you have bigger issues.

So, all that said, it's easy for some of us to just say "Hey man just, blah, blah,blah" because it's easy for us. It may not be easy for you, I don't know where your skill/comfort level lies, so that's something you obviously have to judge for yourself.

For what it's worth, the symptoms you descried sound more like carb issues (i.e, clogged pilot jets or out of sync) than compression issues, but without knowing the numbers, I can't say either way.

Out of curiosity, how many miles are on this thing?

JC

[OneSickPsycho]

Best post I've ever seen from you JC... you should post more on topic content... :beers:

[Particle Man]

Best post I've ever seen from you JC... you should post more on topic content... :beers:

For all the flippant comments, the dude is seriously fuckin' smart

[smileyman]

Best post I've ever seen from you JC... you should post more on topic content... :beers:

Word!

[askmrjesus]

Best post I've ever seen from you JC... you should post more on topic content... :beers:

Thanks, but the thing is, up until a year ago, I was (as douche-bags like to say) in the "motorcycle industry". After fielding 20 -30 calls a day, from dudes who just want to blah,blah,blah about the first bike they ever had, where they rode it, etc...I got to the point where I would pretty much rather talk about anything BUT bikes. :lol: Apparently, I'm starting to recover from that...

Porky, one thing I forgot to ask. You said the mechanic mentioned rust on the heads? The heads are aluminum, which I believe is mostly rust free, so....WTF is he talking about? Where is this rust coming from?

JC

[Rangerscott]

Unless the rust spot is really a hole.

[Particle Man]

did you just call him an a-hole?

[defector]

did you just call him an a-hole?

Rusty a-hole.

[azoomm]

Porky, one thing I forgot to ask. You said the mechanic mentioned rust on the heads? The heads are aluminum, which I believe is mostly rust free, so....WTF is he talking about? Where is this rust coming from?

JC

It's what makes me think his "mechanic" doesn't know what he's doing. But, I've worked with worse. :lol:

[Rangerscott]

I bet there are some people on here with a rusty hole.

[Porkchop]

Sorry for the delay peeps... It has been a LOOOONG day. It got worse. I never actually made it to the dealer. I was running some errands this afternoon and my Taurus dumped its slushbox. If you remember about a year ago I had a leak in my gasket. I used some leak stop and it fixed it. Checked the fluid level every couple weeks... beautiful. Until today. I was stuck in traffic and I think I somehow sprung a leak in my one of the transmission gaskets again. I was driving in some extremely hot bumper to bumper traffic. I noticed every time I turned the trans would shudder when it would shift like last year. By the time I got to an Auto Zone I was having some serious slippage issues into first and second. Mind you this is a span of only 20 minutes. Stopped at AutoZone and checked the trans fluid... low-ish. Look underneath the car, dripping trans fluid. Bottle of leak stop and a half bottle of trans fluid later and I was back on the road, with the symptoms subdued. About 3 miles from home the transmission check light comes on for the first time ever (even with the problems last year). Stop. Check fluid. Seems ok, but getting low. Fill with extra trans fluid. Good to go. NO. As soon as I pull back out it won't sit in first or second gear, just kinda bounces in and out of gear until it gets to third, and then it goes away. I was already a mile from home so I just limped it back.

I just give up.... :bash:

[Particle Man]

Jeez. Time to crack open a beer and tell the world to fuck off for the night.

[Porkchop]

Jeez. Time to crack open a beer and tell the world to fuck off for the night.

Wayyy ahead of you. Tonight was Red White and Boom here in Columbus. Everybody goes and drinks and parties all day downtown. I just said fuck it, I'm not doing that bullshit. I'm sitting at home in an ice cold empty house, watching GP torrents, eating freezer pizza, and drinking a nice cold Amber Bock. Or five.

[RedRider2k2]

Wait.... didn't you sell one of these because you wanted something that was more reliable???
Mine was bullet proof. It just had soggy suspension and square tires. I bought it for my Girlfriend and it's condition was holding back the progression of her learning to ride. So, instead of spending the money to spruce it up, I sold it for a profit and replaced it with a newer one. But, I did these things based on things that I knew to be true. Not someone else's opinion. That's why I recommend doing your own inspection on it. Dont just take someone's word for it.

The engine in my CBR crapped out on me last fall too. Before I had even rolled to a stop I was already pretty sure what was wrong with it. By the time I got it home I was already going over the process of rebuilding the engine in my head. When it comes to Bikes, I have a hard time affording a lot of repairs on a lemon but I REALLY cant afford to just bail on one and totally lose out.

[Rangerscott]

Damn dude. If I was close I'd tear it apart for you.

Sounds like a fundraiser is in need you busted ass rider/driver.

[Porkchop]

Mine was bullet proof. It just had soggy suspension and square tires. I bought it for my Girlfriend and it's condition was holding back the progression of her learning to ride. So, instead of spending the money to spruce it up, I sold it for a profit and replaced it with a newer one. But, I did these things based on things that I knew to be true. Not someone else's opinion. That's why I recommend doing your own inspection on it. Dont just take someone's word for it.

The engine in my CBR crapped out on me last fall too. Before I had even rolled to a stop I was already pretty sure what was wrong with it. By the time I got it home I was already going over the process of rebuilding the engine in my head. When it comes to Bikes, I have a hard time affording a lot of repairs on a lemon but I REALLY cant afford to just bail on one and totally lose out.

:lol::lol::lol: Fork dive and a saggy shock on a vf500? Never...

The thing is I'm not very mechanically inclined. I've had this Taurus my entire driving life. Only replacements were brakes and normal preventative maintinance. Other than a bent fork, some lightbulbs, and preventative maintinace, my R6 never had problems. This VF has had more problems than anything I have ever seen. Doing the work I was on it was stretching my mechanical experience. So like Jesus said, in an earlier post, anything about engine work comes out like the teacher from Charley Brown. :lol: If I had the free time, I might think about buying some sort of manual, but I have almost no free time right now.

And if these two guys come through, I am going to be selling it for what I paid for it. Not a bad deal for a broken bike.

Damn dude. If I was close I'd tear it apart for you.

Sounds like a fundraiser is in need you busted ass rider/driver.

Wish you could man. It would be sweet to chill. A fundraiser would be nice, but a real paying job would be better. I wonder if my mom is regretting telling me to turn down all those job offers.... now that I'm going to be bugging her like shit to give me some of my bonds for either fixing my car or getting another one.

[Porkchop]

It's the "just guessing" part that bothers me.

I ran my own shop for several years, and I can't tell you how many guys would show up with a bike that was pronounced D.O.A by a dealership, only to find out that I could have it running in two days.

The thing is, a lot of shops don't want to fuck with old bikes. Partly, because they don't think you're going to want (or be able to) spend what it will take to fix the thing at a shop rate of $45.00 an hour or more. The other reason? They're lazy, and it's a hell of a lot easier to do brake jobs and oil changes, than it is to actually fix something. Profit, of course, also figures into this equation.

So, back to your bike- Lack of compression is caused one or two reasons (or a combination of one and two) bad rings or bad valves.

The first thing I would ask, would be the results of the compression test. What's the spec compression supposed to be, vs. was the reading was? If it's within 25% of where it's supposed to be, that's usually just normal wear.

Bad rings, as previously noted, is not too big of a deal, unless the cylinders are so far gone that they need to be re-bored. Unfortunately, there's no way to know that without tearing it down, inspecting for pits, and mic-ing the bore to see if it falls within spec. You probably don't have a micrometer that will do that, but a local machine shop could do the measuring for you, for not much dough.

Checking the valves is actually relatively simple. Pull the heads off, and yank the camshafts. All the valves are now, or should be, in the closed position. Place the head on a bench and level it with the combustion chambers upward. Fill the chambers with alcohol. Go to bed. Wake up, and see if the alcohol is still there. Yes? Good. No? Bad. 50% of the valve issues I've dealt with, were caused by carbon build up (caused by putting around at low RPM's). Simply cleaning up the valves and the seats will cure this. If the valves still leak after cleaning, you have bigger issues.

So, all that said, it's easy for some of us to just say "Hey man just, blah, blah,blah" because it's easy for us. It may not be easy for you, I don't know where your skill/comfort level lies, so that's something you obviously have to judge for yourself.

For what it's worth, the symptoms you descried sound more like carb issues (i.e, clogged pilot jets or out of sync) than compression issues, but without knowing the numbers, I can't say either way.

Out of curiosity, how many miles are on this thing?

JC

They are like $57 an hour for labor.

There were 3,600 miles on it. Yes.... there is no other zero after that.

I thought it was carbs when I brought it in, but when we talked on the phone he said it had almost no compression and it wouldn't start. Since I had my car thing today I didnt get to talk to him to get actual compression figures. As far as the "old bike" thing, this is a used bike dealership, and they buy classic bikes on a regular basis. I am good friends with the owner so I can go in the back shop area where customers cant. They have tons of classic bikes, mostly cruisers, that they can suppliment their stock with if they get too low on new cruisers and sportbikes. So they do work on them.

Best post I've ever seen from you JC... you should post more on topic content... :beers:

Because this is a motorcycle topic in a motorcycle forum. Its crazy when we actually start talking about the reason that brings us here.... :lol:

[Rangerscott]

I know the 5th/6th gens have an aluminum powder composition cylinder sleeves instead of regular old iron sleeves.


Have you ever set the valves?

[Homeslice]

Dump it dude.......You are not a mechanic, and you aren't losing any money parting it out. You can pick up a running SV650 for $2000. I would much rather try to keep one of those alive than a 27-yr old Honda.

[Rangerscott]

Dump it dude.......You are not a mechanic, and you aren't losing any money parting it out. You can pick up a running SV650 for $2000. I would much rather try to keep one of those alive than a 27-yr old Honda.

Youre not adventurous.