Probably gonna make some enemies, but...

[Yamerhaw]

does anyone besides me NOT like motards? i mean i've rode several, and they are VERY quick in the real tight stuff(been smoked by several), but i've never had the urge to own one, they just seem a bit slow and weakly



:sorry:


not knocking anybody's choice, just my opinion, you can hate my bike if ya want!

[ericr]

I wouldn't want one as my only bike but if i lived closer to the real mountain roads I'd be jonesin for one. Sure, for any distance or straight line riding they're at the bottom of the performance list, but for a tight track or a road like Deals Gap they'd be a blast. I just like them for what they're good for.

[PhiSig1071]

I love mine!

It handles great, accelerates quickly, stops on a dime, plus it's the ultimate hooligan bike! I can jump curbs and wheelie at will. It's all in what you want, I have the GSXR when I want to go faster, and I have the KTM for when I want to goof-off.

[Amber Lamps]

I wanted a KTM 525 SMC sooo bad when they came out! They had a deal where they gave you both the on and off road equipment for the same price! :drool: Then I rode one and I was severely disappointed...I haven't wanted a "real" motard since. I guess that the liter class motards are alot faster,etc but to me they aren't really motards. The only reason I'd want one now is if I could race it.

[azoomm]

I hated them.

I thought they made you look *stupid* :lol:

Then I played on a few on the track.... giddy schoolkid hooligan kind of fun. :dthumb:

[PhiSig1071]

I wanted a KTM 525 SMC sooo bad when they came out! They had a deal where they gave you both the on and off road equipment for the same price! :drool: Then I rode one and I was severely disappointed...I haven't wanted a "real" motard since. I guess that the liter class motards are alot faster,etc but to me they aren't really motards. The only reason I'd want one now is if I could race it.

I totally agree! To me a motard is a light weight bike, the liter-class "tards" are too heavy, to me they're just streetfighters.

[speedylocksmith]

I wouldn't ONLY have a motard, but I would LOVE to have one.

[t-homo]

I love mine!

It handles great, accelerates quickly, stops on a dime, plus it's the ultimate hooligan bike! I can jump curbs and wheelie at will. It's all in what you want, I have the GSXR when I want to go faster, and I have the KTM for when I want to goof-off.

You are convincing me of their coolness. Now if I weren't so fuckin short.

[Amber Lamps]

You are convincing me of their coolness. Now if I weren't so fuckin short.


Ummm...I don't think dick length would be a handicap.:whistle:

[t-homo]

Ummm...I don't think dick length would be a handicap.:whistle:

Yeah, but a motard wont help it near the way a sportbike will. Literbikes FTW! lolz

[CrazyKell]

Never for the street but I want one for track like a fat kid wants cake!

[Ninjakel]

I wouldn't ONLY have a motard, but I would LOVE to have one.



Yup, me too. I'm still waiting for Casey to deliver his to me for a week of so.

[marko138]

I'd love to have one.

[speedylocksmith]

Yup, me too. I'm still waiting for Casey to deliver his to me for a week of so.Let me know. I'll bring the beer and we'll make it a day of test rides :lmao:

[tlstreak]

I cant stand them. Feel like im wearing my wives panties for a seat.
They are fun in the curves , out of them , buzzy under powered thongs on a motor.

I look foreward to getting a chance to try out some of the new larger types. You could give me a sm dr whatever and Id sell it for something else.

[Ninjakel]

Let me know. I'll bring the beer and we'll make it a day of test rides :lmao:


IN! :rockwoot:

[PhiSig1071]

There are definitely disadvantages, I'll give you that.

The seat is narrow, thankfully I'm tall so I can slide back to the rear of the seat which is more comfy. They do suck on the highway, no way around it, thankfully mine has a pretty big motor so it'll cruise comfortably at 80 no problem. Try that on the DRZ and it'll feel like it's going to explode. Plus the tank on my bike is tiny, I only get about 60-70 miles before I flip it to reserve.

Honestly, it is actually a fantastic commuter bike, as long as your commute isn't a lot of highway. It's light, nimble, easy to ride and fun, I used to have a 45 minute commute to get to school, and I loved taking the 'tard, and it was about half highway.

[neebelung]

does anyone besides me NOT like motards? i mean i've rode several, and they are VERY quick in the real tight stuff(been smoked by several), but i've never had the urge to own one, they just seem a bit slow and weakly



:sorry:


not knocking anybody's choice, just my opinion, you can hate my bike if ya want!

I'm not a fan of them. :shrug: I just don't see the appeal. I mean I know they apparently are a blast to RIDE, but a big part of riding is the lust you feel for your bike. You have to be sexually attracted to it, in a sense, and 'tards just don't hold that lust to me.

There are some slight exceptions -- the SuperDuke is pretty sweet, but in general, nope, I'm with you. I'll pass on the tards. I'd take a super sexy nekkid bike instead.

[FT BSTRD]

I think it depends on how you get your jollies. I've ridden with many liter bike folks who couldn't do curves for shit but would run a buck 60 on the interstate.

If you are a flat out, top speed kind of person, the motard won't scratch that itch. If you are a twisty freak, the motard is all good. You are willing to plod along getting your nuts vibed into numb oblivion in order to carve the corners.

Motards are fun in that you just crack 'em open and rarely let off and just rip the turns.

[tlstreak]

I disagree with that. I dont live that far away from you, so its all curves. Yammerhaw too. Only place ive rode a tard is in the mountains, basically it took less than half the skill to push the tard than a sportbike. There are people that only ride tards. Which is fine, take them off the tard and put them ona sport bike and they are no where near the level they think they are against others that have rode prior to the tards becoming popular.

That comment is for 1st bike owners that have yet switch to a dedicated sport bike. There are alot of them out there.

You ride long enough you find the rythem of the roads you love. Your breathing is steady, you feel everything, and get the heart pumping. You can almost get a tunnel vision and all you see is the next transition or apex pushing the bike around. Never got that inspiration on a tard, that FIX from riding. Just my .02

[Phenix_Rider]

If you are a flat out, top speed kind of person, the motard won't scratch that itch. If you are a twisty freak, the motard is all good. You are willing to plod along getting your nuts vibed into numb oblivion in order to carve the corners.


:lol: No thanks. The only reason I'd have a 'tard is to run on a go-kart track. Just not a livable street bike to me. Though, one might be interesting on the rougher farm roads around here.

[FT BSTRD]

I disagree with that. I dont live that far away from you, so its all curves. Yammerhaw too. Only place ive rode a tard is in the mountains, basically it took less than half the skill to push the tard than a sportbike. There are people that only ride tards. Which is fine, take them off the tard and put them ona sport bike and they are no where near the level they think they are against others that have rode prior to the tards becoming popular.

Oh, I agree completely. That was my point, though. In the really tight twisties, motard are easier to get around the bend. I'm no racer, but I can hold my own. I can't tell you how many times I've had a motard pass me on the outside of a turn and squirt away riding Deal's. Part of it is that I suck, but the vast majority is that motards are just easier to get around the corners.

My bike's no slouch in the turns, but a bike with less than half the horsepower and half the weight is better suited for the turns. Your trade off is that the straights SUCK. I can hit the turn perfectly, holding the perfect line, at the maximum of tire grip, bike lean, and suspension tolerance and still not out corner a motard. The motard rider isn't even breathing hard.

Put a motard only rider on a bike that is less nimble than theirs, and the skills we have had to develop to get our bikes around the turn aren't as polished because they haven't had to work as hard to get their rig from point A to point B around the turn.



What I REALLY want is this:

http://img.moto22.com/galleries/450-super-mono-de-roland-sands/normal_450_super_mono_00.jpg

http://hellforleathermagazine.com/images/rsd-prod-450.jpg

http://www.latimes.com/media/photo/2008-02/35266143.jpg



I think this is where the motard fad is going.

I can't wait to get a chance to ride the RC4:

http://www.moto-station.com/ttesimages/motodivers/KTM_RC4_stpz.jpg


All the flickability of a motard without having to rebuild the top end every 2500 miles.

[HRCNICK11]

Real fun on Kart tracks. I have a crf150r and a DRZ400sm and goto Kart tracks all the time its way cheaper than full sized tracks and just as fun. Also the tards have studed ice tires on them right now.

Oh and show me a sportbike that you can crash several times in a day(My friend Teddy is a clown) and not even need a single spare part. No really my CRF150R hit the ground 3 times in one day and was fine every time. Never even scratched the bodywork, just the sliders. Never broke a lever nothing.

The most fun you'll ever have at deals gap is riding a tard through the dragon. Its the only time I have ever gotten to the end of the road and turned around and rode it again with out a break. I must say the first time I put the bike in forth gear on the dragon felt strange though. Its just not right after riding the road in 2nd gear for years and years.

A tard on a curvy dirt road around lakes and in the mountains is a blast. We even found some 2 track bear trails near the dragon that were fun as hell.

[JARVIS518]

never rode one but i love the way they look
i want one so bad
but i will keep the sport bike for riding 2 up and for long highway rides

[ceo012384]

they just seem a bit slow and weakly
It must suck to have a small pee-pee. Condolences.
You are convincing me of their coolness. Now if I weren't so fuckin short.
I am 5' 8" and have ridden several tards. No problems.

I also ride my high-seat-height R6 with no problems as well.

You just have to get used to it.
The seat is narrow, thankfully I'm tall so I can slide back to the rear of the seat which is more comfy. They do suck on the highway, no way around it, thankfully mine has a pretty big motor so it'll cruise comfortably at 80 no problem. Try that on the DRZ and it'll feel like it's going to explode. Plus the tank on my bike is tiny, I only get about 60-70 miles before I flip it to reserve.

Honestly, it is actually a fantastic commuter bike, as long as your commute isn't a lot of highway. It's light, nimble, easy to ride and fun, I used to have a 45 minute commute to get to school, and I loved taking the 'tard, and it was about half highway.
Agreed for the most part... but my buddy's DRZ is great on the highway. It'll top out at 110. You can ride it at 75 all day long with no problems at all. For short highway jaunts it's fine. It has a 39mm flatside carb and yosh exhaust.

Obviously I wouldn't want to ride any tard all day on the highway though. That's why you take alternate routes of side roads ;)

[neebelung]

If you are a twisty freak, the motard is all good.

....if we had twisties in FL, I might become more of a Tard fan. :lol:

[SteveP]

As most have said I wouldn't want one as a daily driver. But if I had the extra cash around for one it would be fun.

[BobTheBiker]

I"d LOVE a tard for a second bike just to play hooligan on. I'd have to have the DRZ though, no doubt, the 400SM is just the shit for me. i'm sure I could work a way around the fuel tank issue and find a larger tank, the seat height is just a minor adjustment, and I"m good. just gimme gimme gimme.

[pickle.of.doom]

I heart my motard.

Yeah, my DRZ does about 110 indicated top speed, 80 on the freeway is no problem, but after 20 miles your ass hurts. Its not made for highway cruising, thats why I have the Superhawk too.

[PhiSig1071]

:scratch:

I'm fairly accomplished on either bike, GSXR or Motard. I also love pushing other bikes hard through the twisties, I have scraped pegs two-up on a Concours and ground the ends off of the pegs on a meanstreak.

I love the MonoGP bikes, but to me they lose a lot of the advantages of a 'tard, you lose the long-travel suspension, ground clearance, and especially important the leverage of the wide bars. They're a great alternative to a 125 or 250 two-stroke road racer, and they might be the best "starter" sportbike in existence, but to me they're not an alternative to a tard. They have no advantages over a tard and on a tight twisty technical track a tard would win, more cornering clearance and more leverage in the bars means better handling.

Oh and BTW, the RC4 has the same basic motor as the SMC, so neither bike needs a rebuild that often.

[FT BSTRD]

Oh and BTW, the RC4 has the same basic motor as the SMC, so neither bike needs a rebuild that often.


Agreed.

[Smittie61984]

The first bike I wanted was a KLR650. Not a motard but I've always liked the Dual Sport look.

I'd like a motard but probably the new Yamaha 225(I think that's it). Something light to flick around. I'd really love to motard out a CR500 just for the Holy Shit factor.

But I want a true dual sport before I get a motard.

[OneSickPsycho]

I do too much distance riding to consider one as an only bike... I'd love one to crash into shit and tear up my commute with... All goes as planned, a motard will be my next bike.

[pickle.of.doom]

Yeah OSP, I couldn't own JUST the motard..

[Phenix_Rider]

I do too much distance riding to consider one as an only bike... I'd love one to crash into shit and tear up my commute with... All goes as planned, a motard will be my next bike.

Weren't you saying that when you wrecked the Buell? And when you got the Honda, and still now you have the TLR. :idk:

[Mr Lefty]

I've never ridden one... and up until recently I never could understand the draw... but as of lately... I'm start'n to take a liking to them... no idea why... it's not like I've recently seen or done something that's drawn me in... or at least nothing I can put my finger on.

I'd like to ride one first... but I'd love to have one in my garage... but to be honest... there really isn't a bike I wouldn't have room for in my garage given the space and money :lol:

[OneSickPsycho]

Weren't you saying that when you wrecked the Buell? And when you got the Honda, and still now you have the TLR. :idk:

Yeah... hell, I was saying that before I got the Buell... I came to the conclusion real quick that I couldn't just own a motard and unfortunately my finances have not allowed me to have two bikes... yet.

I've never ridden one... and up until recently I never could understand the draw... but as of lately... I'm start'n to take a liking to them... no idea why... it's not like I've recently seen or done something that's drawn me in... or at least nothing I can put my finger on.

I'd like to ride one first... but I'd love to have one in my garage... but to be honest... there really isn't a bike I wouldn't have room for in my garage given the space and money :lol:

Don't watch part I cause it plays a Disturbed song... But this has Jump Da Fuck Up, which is awesome... Oh, and this pretty much is why I want a motard...
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Qo0pZ5gpjj8

[Amber Lamps]

Yeah... hell, I was saying that before I got the Buell... I came to the conclusion real quick that I couldn't just own a motard and unfortunately my finances have not allowed me to have two bikes... yet.



Don't watch part I cause it plays a Disturbed song... But this has Jump Da Fuck Up, which is awesome... Oh, and this pretty much is why I want a motard...
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Qo0pZ5gpjj8

Man,things have really changed! I rarely like to break out the "S" word but seriously....Those guys couldn't keep it in their own lanes and riding on the sidewalk,up and down steps outside of churches and schools? If that exact video was made using GSXRs you would all be screaming "SQUID!" at the top of your lungs! BTW I have video of a buddy of mine performing WAY better jumps on a GSXR750. Don't get me wrong,I used to do that kind of shit all the time on my enduro,of course it was a 1972 MX250 and I was in HIGH SCHOOL!!!

[xx CURVE xx]

does anyone besides me NOT like motards? i mean i've rode several, and they are VERY quick in the real tight stuff(been smoked by several), but i've never had the urge to own one, they just seem a bit slow and weakly


Tards aren't for fat dudes :eatatthey:

[Amber Lamps]

Tards aren't for fat dudes :eatatthey:

:zowned:

[OneSickPsycho]

Man,things have really changed! I rarely like to break out the "S" word but seriously....Those guys couldn't keep it in their own lanes and riding on the sidewalk,up and down steps outside of churches and schools? If that exact video was made using GSXRs you would all be screaming "SQUID!" at the top of your lungs! BTW I have video of a buddy of mine performing WAY better jumps on a GSXR750. Don't get me wrong,I used to do that kind of shit all the time on my enduro,of course it was a 1972 MX250 and I was in HIGH SCHOOL!!!

I don't deny the squidliness of those guys, but riding all over the place, including stairs and loading docks is something I would certainly be doing a lot of if I had a 'tard... I'd be jumping medians and tearing through people's yards all the fucking time...

Tards aren't for fat dudes :eatatthey:


Damnit.

[Yamerhaw]

I disagree with that. I dont live that far away from you, so its all curves. Yammerhaw too. Only place ive rode a tard is in the mountains, basically it took less than half the skill to push the tard than a sportbike. There are people that only ride tards. Which is fine, take them off the tard and put them ona sport bike and they are no where near the level they think they are against others that have rode prior to the tards becoming popular.

That comment is for 1st bike owners that have yet switch to a dedicated sport bike. There are alot of them out there.

You ride long enough you find the rythem of the roads you love. Your breathing is steady, you feel everything, and get the heart pumping. You can almost get a tunnel vision and all you see is the next transition or apex pushing the bike around. Never got that inspiration on a tard, that FIX from riding. Just my .02


yep, all we have is curves around here, no interstate, not even a really long straight, and some roads with awesome sweepers you can haul more ass through than the tards, its really just the tight stuff that i see the tard doing excellent in

[Yamerhaw]

Tards aren't for fat dudes :eatatthey:

maybe, but i'm not fat:idk:

[Yamerhaw]

it would be funny to drag race one though, just steadily stay beside them while they tach em out through high gear as you shift into 2nd:moon:

[PhiSig1071]

I don't deny the squidliness of those guys, but riding all over the place, including stairs and loading docks is something I would certainly be doing a lot of if I had a 'tard... I'd be jumping medians and tearing through people's yards all the fucking time...




Damnit.

Oh yeah. The options are limitless on a tard! Oh and they're fine for fat people, I'm 6'4" 225 and I ride one!

[OneSickPsycho]

Oh yeah. The options are limitless on a tard! Oh and they're fine for fat people, I'm 6'4" 225 and I ride one!

Awesome... I'm back in...

[PhiSig1071]

Awesome... I'm back in...

If you ever made it to Jax (and didn't actually hate me :lol: ) you could take mine for a spin.

[OneSickPsycho]

If you ever made it to Jax (and didn't actually hate me :lol: ) you could take mine for a spin.

While I'm riding it... You can look at my TLR. :D

[PhiSig1071]

While I'm riding it... You can look at my TLR. :D

:tt:

[OneSickPsycho]

:tt:

:lol:

[t-homo]

I think a trials bike would be a BLAST!!

[Homeslice]

does anyone besides me NOT like motards? i mean i've rode several, and they are VERY quick in the real tight stuff(been smoked by several), but i've never had the urge to own one, they just seem a bit slow and weakly


Agreed.............Just goof-off bikes, not serious commuters. Try going an extended 80-90 mph on one and you'll be hating life. I can't see someone using it as their only bike, unless their commute is only 5 minutes. :idk:

[marko138]

The common knock on the Motards appears to be hiway riding. WHO THE FUCK RIDES THE HIWAY? FUCK YOU. Get your ass on some real roads.

[tlstreak]

I live in an area that most would kill to live in. There are still long jaunts between roads. 10-20 miles at a time. Then when one of those 20% chance of thunder showers hit you, time to find a straight way out of the area, that could be 50-100 miles real quick to be dry and continue riding.

[PhiSig1071]

Agreed.............Just goof-off bikes, not serious commuters. Try going an extended 80-90 mph on one and you'll be hating life. I can't see someone using it as their only bike, unless their commute is only 5 minutes. :idk:

I used to have about a 45 minute commute that was about half highway, and I did it on the 'tard quite a few times. And enjoyed it.

[azoomm]

Agreed.............Just goof-off bikes, not serious commuters. Try going an extended 80-90 mph on one and you'll be hating life. I can't see someone using it as their only bike, unless their commute is only 5 minutes. :idk:

We have one that has it as his only vehicle here on this board... xx Curve xx

;)

[Carolina]

I would love one if I could swing it
http://i115.photobucket.com/albums/n306/jpracecraft/ktm690smrfty2.jpg

[Homeslice]

The common knock on the Motards appears to be hiway riding. WHO THE FUCK RIDES THE HIWAY? FUCK YOU. Get your ass on some real roads.
Some people DO use their bikes for commuting, not just weekend rides

[Yamerhaw]

The common knock on the Motards appears to be hiway riding. WHO THE FUCK RIDES THE HIWAY? FUCK YOU. Get your ass on some real roads.


here's a vid from "part" of "one" of the roads me and tlstreak ride where we live, let me know where ya see the freeway(by the way we live in the mountains, not even a freeway here if we wanted to ride one)

not me in the vid, just one i found for an example


http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=LPcguQlns0M

[HRCNICK11]

it would be funny to drag race one though, just steadily stay beside them while they tach em out through high gear as you shift into 2nd

Yeah yeah any squid can ride in a straight line. Whats really fun is handing a guy on a GSXR1000 his ass on the track on my 39 horse power DRZ400sm even thought the track has a 1/2 mile long straight. I think they put the straight there so guys with liter bikes can can keep the rest of us in sight for a few laps.

No no the best is when they pass the DRZ on the staight and think they are just going to run away and then you pass them still on the gas after they have already started down shifting for turn one. Yeah thats classic.

Or or when you back it in to the hair pin and they run off in the grass cause they are so busy watching me ride they forget to brake for the corner.

[HRCNICK11]

Agreed.............Just goof-off bikes, not serious commuters. Try going an extended 80-90 mph on one and you'll be hating life. I can't see someone using it as their only bike, unless their commute is only 5 minutes.

I rode my DRZ for 5 days straight and was less sore than my sportbike. Sure your ass can get a little sore but your back and wrists are fine. But I also had a RC51 and they are kind of a rack. Oh if your butt gets sore on a motard you just stand up you can ride a motard easy in the standing position. MX boots are a must have to stand up for long though or your feet could get sore.

But all in all they are not that uncomfortable and compaired to my RC51 they are way better.

[Homeslice]

5 days straight doing what kind of mileage, and what kind of roads? Doing 1 hour straight at 75-80 mph? No thanks.

[HRCNICK11]

It was around the deals gap area. One reason tards have a bad rap for the seat is KTMs have a hard seat, crazy hard seat. I was on a suzuki, lots better.

The KTM seats can be made better either with softer foam or by drilling holes from the bottom most of the way through the foam. It makes a big difference to the 2 X 4 that it has for a seat. Also you can cut it down (the step you see on a lot of bikes) to make it lower and wider for better handling and comfort.

[marko138]

I would love one if I could swing it
http://i115.photobucket.com/albums/n306/jpracecraft/ktm690smrfty2.jpg

Bad ass.

[OneSickPsycho]

Bad ass.

Except the exhaust... Not sure if I want to ride it, or smoke bees out of their nests...

http://cache.daylife.com/imageserve/00x2fux47q1iw/610x.jpg

[marko138]

Except the exhaust... Not sure if I want to ride it, or smoke bees out of their nests...

http://cache.daylife.com/imageserve/00x2fux47q1iw/610x.jpg
:lol: It does look like that.

[Homeslice]

I actually think it looks great. I love hi-exit cans. But then I test-rode one, and I'm like uh.....I'll stick to sportbikes.

[ceo012384]

The common knock on the Motards appears to be hiway riding. WHO THE FUCK RIDES THE HIWAY? FUCK YOU. Get your ass on some real roads.
This man is spot-on.

[Yamerhaw]

This man is spot-on.



you must have missed my last post, so again, let me say this is "part" of just one of the roads here where i live and ride, let me know where you see the freeway!




www.youtube.com/watch?v=LPcguQlns0M

[ceo012384]

Well if that's the roads you like to ride, then try out a friend's tard...

[Yamerhaw]

Well if that's the roads you like to ride, then try out a friend's tard...


thats just one of the roads, and the tards are very quick there in the tight stuff, but on some other, quicker roads with some fast sweepers, etc, they just need a little more steam, i was just showing the video to show we dont ride freeways/highways!

[LeeNetworX]

I think they are kind of cool; they have their place. I've seen some guys in the mountains here just flat out MOVE on them. Made me feel like a retard.

[unknownroad]

I'm not a fan of them. :shrug: I just don't see the appeal. I mean I know they apparently are a blast to RIDE, but a big part of riding is the lust you feel for your bike. You have to be sexually attracted to it, in a sense, and 'tards just don't hold that lust to me.

Shoot, and I had heard that those single-cylinder bikes vibrated like a mofo at high RPM :sorry:

Tards aren't for fat dudes :eatatthey:

Guess that's why I've never seen the appeal. :idk: Maybe it's a regional thing... around here, no tracks, no twisties, no motards. Just can't see spending real money on a bike that limited.

[neebelung]

Shoot, and I had heard that those single-cylinder bikes vibrated like a mofo at high RPM :sorry:


If I wanted that sort of buzziness, I'd get an FZ1. :lol:

[KSGregman]

I want one....BAD....BUT only as a "toy"....for when I'm feeling particularly hooligan-ish. Every time I'm at the bike shop with my wife, I look at the DRZ-400SM and she says "DON'T EVEN THINK IT....I've seen you ride a dirt bike and you're NOT having one on the street!" :lmao:

[t-homo]

You really want a hooligan bike?

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=KCy9nrchqFI

[ericr]

You really want a hooligan bike?


That is SOOOOooooo freakin awesome!!!!! I'd love to be able to ride like that!!!

[Yamerhaw]

thats pretty damn awesome

[OneSickPsycho]

+1 on trials bikes... When someone first posted those videos I started searching all over for a cheap used one... I found that you either keep your trials bike forever, or 30 some years... There's no inbetween.