Originally Posted by Gas Man (Post 469766)

Well I won't get into why... at this point... legal reasons...

I'm looking at sports cars... remember mine is I-4 turbo with about 275hp/340 ft lbs.

NO MORE GM PRODUCTS PERIOD!!!

No Mustangs, cause they are "me too" cars.

Test drove a Mazda Speed3, about a week ago. Nice more linear power feel compared to the brute power of my HHRSS. Tight car but not sure it's all there. $24k - discount. Owned by Ford, made in japan. Eat little crow but still... hell even use my Ford discount on one.

test drove a 2011 RX-8 GT today. Great great great looking car. Beyond awesome sounding motor (needs pipes, like all stocks). Tight crisp 6 speed manual. Superb seats, feel, 50/50 weight distribution, cornered on rails. Back seat has a stupid center console that would hinder Brinks hauling. Then you plant down the right foot... the 9k start of red-line is WOW. But a complete lack of power. My HHRSS will beat it in a race. It is about the same amount of power/speed as the Speed3. But it's $8K more! WTF!! Isn't this the Mazda flag ship?? :td:

Tried to test drive a Challenger RT Classic with A DAMN MANUAL AKA STICK SHIFT AKA 6 SPEED AKA NON SLUSH BOX!!! F'in 2 dealers didn't have one. one even had a SRT8 (out of my price range) in a F'in auto!!!! :wtfru: FU*KSTICKS!!

Going tomry to look at a NW GTI, Nissan 370Z (big negative is no back seat) & Altima coupe

Maybe then a WRX limited. Saw a Lancer EVO at the dealer but F that $45k tag.

I would like to keep it near $30k. HOWEVER, some of these are closer to $35k. I MAY be ok with that if it makes me grin. :dribble:

Ideas?

Originally Posted by Drewpy (Post 469769)

The WRX is a great car when you dont try to push 400hp through it. I loved that car and will own one once again, just not in the near future

Originally Posted by derf (Post 469770)

Yeh the RX8 is a huge letdown, especially after how great the RX7 was.

My brother has a 2011 Subaru 2.5 sport, pretty sweet car. at 170 hp its no super race car, but it will haul ass on any road you throw at it, and get decent gas mileage too. I'm not to impressed with the 2012 new model imprezza, they dropped the engine down to a 2 liter and the hp down to 140, but that was only to get better gas mileage.

Originally Posted by Dave (Post 469772)

hyundai genesis turbo.

Originally Posted by derf (Post 469770)

Yeh the RX8 is a huge letdown, especially after how great the RX7 was. I had both the first and second gen rx7s and they both kicked ass. The 1st gen was kinda underpowered with a 12a engine, but it was completely stripped down brining the weight bellow 2,000 lbs and handled like it was on rails. My 2nd gen had the turbo motor 13b-t and once it started to produce boost it would just lay the power down. I was trying to buy a 3rd gen but they are just too pricey for me and I wound up with a ford focus instead.

My brother has a 2011 Subaru 2.5 sport, pretty sweet car. at 170 hp its no super race car, but it will haul ass on any road you throw at it, and get decent gas mileage too. I'm not to impressed with the 2012 new model imprezza, they dropped the engine down to a 2 liter and the hp down to 140, but that was only to get better gas mileage.

Originally Posted by Gas Man (Post 469774)

I hear that... but I wonder if it is a "me too" car as well. That's another aspect I liked the RX8 was they simply aren't many of them around here.



I agree on the RX8. But I totally felt like it would go as fast as I could make it around the corner, like you are saying about the subi.

Another aspect I don't like about the subi is the distance I have to drive to get to a dealer. I'm use to having a dealer 5 mins from my house. But I guess that doesn't matter if you don't need to take it in all the time.



Um... hyundai might be pushing my new open mind.

Originally Posted by Gas Man (Post 469774)

I agree on the RX8. But I totally felt like it would go as fast as I could make it around the corner, like you are saying about the subi.

Another aspect I don't like about the subi is the distance I have to drive to get to a dealer. I'm use to having a dealer 5 mins from my house. But I guess that doesn't matter if you don't need to take it in all the time.

Originally Posted by Dave (Post 469775)

i loved it, its just a "balance" car not a "power" car. do some boltons, haul the kids around, do some autocross/gymkanha.

Originally Posted by derf (Post 469782)

Yeh, I was just very underwhelmed by the RX8, almost like the designers forgot what made the RX7 such a great car. The 2011 and prior imprezza just seems to get better with every year, just by the spec sheet I'm not impressed with the 2012. But the 2011 2.5 (not the sti or the wrx), while not a super powerhouse can handle its own on any road. I never felt like it would do something other than exactly what i wanted. If I wanted to drift it I could, if I wanted to just rail around corners I could. Neither RX7 had room for kids, but it could carry groceries if you didnt buy much. Neither of them were practical cars.






The first gen was completely stripped down, there was no interior at all, no carpet, no dashboard, no anything, just a sheet aluminum dash, the standard guages, a momo steering wheel, a race seat for the driver and a hard plasic seat for the passenger, all the glass except for the windshield was replaced with plexiglass (I did have a small vent that I could pop open for fresh air). The car just felt right when I drove it, it wasnt a monster but it had teeth.

Originally Posted by Gas Man (Post 469798)

What??

Profit what?

I didn't get any winfall. Far from it. Looking at DD replacement. Can explain but over phone not in print.

Originally Posted by Gas Man (Post 469766)

....NO MORE GM PRODUCTS PERIOD!!!...

Originally Posted by Gas Man (Post 469813)

101. It saddens me to be at the point I am with gm. Especially when I have 2 retired family members from there. So no, camaro isn't an option.

Originally Posted by Gas Man (Post 469813)

101. It saddens me to be at the point I am with gm. Especially when I have 2 retired family members from there. So no, camaro isn't an option.

Osp. Ya know. That has always been a dream but where would I stop. Further, I want reliable. Stop would be an old muscle car with new frame, suspension, and fi motor. Its been done many times but not for my price range.

I may check the genesis. Different day, as wife and I have plans later.

Originally Posted by OneSickPsycho (Post 469810)

Fuck new... Take your 30 g's and buy an old, restored muscle car.

Originally Posted by derf (Post 469818)

I'm with you, I'm just not impressed by the quality of american vehicles, I've bought a bunch and it seems that japanese cars just seem to last longer without any problems.

Originally Posted by pauldun170 (Post 469824)

I've seen it on the road quite a few times and it is definitely a sharp looking car. Not too many of them so you wont see yourself coming and going. I personally thing the mustang is a better value but if american cars are off your list and you want a new car the Genesis is worth a look. Have you considered used G37's?
The only issue with those is that you are automatically a deuschebag as soon as you turn the engine on and the only station that comes through on the radio is club music.

Originally Posted by Cutty72 (Post 469828)

RX8 for your area = suck. Burn a lot of oil, suck in the cold, suck in the snow/ice, and no power till redline.

I'd go w/the speed3. Love that car, and if I was car shopping for myself, that would for sure be on the short list. I know you can get programing to give you full power in the first 3 gears too, not sure if that would be helpful though!



Truth...

Originally Posted by Gas Man (Post 469839)

Hell I just read on Ford.com that the Focus ST is to be released to US for 2012. I wonder when that is.

Originally Posted by Gas Man (Post 469839)

Hell I just read on Ford.com that the Focus ST is to be released to US for 2012. I wonder when that is.

Originally Posted by Gas Man (Post 469813)

101. It saddens me to be at the point I am with gm. Especially when I have 2 retired family members from there. So no, camaro isn't an option. ...

Originally Posted by OneSickPsycho (Post 469810)

Fuck new... Take your 30 g's and buy an old, restored muscle car.

Originally Posted by Dave (Post 469841)

is that still the turbo 5 cylinder? might be worth waiting for. volvo c30 is basically the same thing though, thats a fun little car too, 5 bangers have this amazing intake wail

Originally Posted by 101lifts2 (Post 469872)

Why the sudden change? Are you trying to get GM to buy your back? Also, you did buy a Trailblazer and a Cobalt (HHR), not the top of the line GM products. lol

I've owned a 2008 STS Caddy, which was my fav. vehicle of all the vehicles I've owned. The powertrain, smoothness and quietness was just done right. Japan just doesn't have the feel that the bigger American cars do on the freeway.

I think the Genesis looks like a Altima copy with a bad rear side window layout. The interior is only OK. I know three guys that work for Hyundai in Irvine...they tell me Hyundai really only cares about how the car looks...quality is a distant second. They also don't understand how cars even get to market as the Koreans are a strange bunch.

If you are worried about reliability, get a Honda with a manual transmission such as an Accord.

The Mazda 3 IMO has too underassisted steering. VW seems to be the best in terms of steering, braking and chassis. I'd say get a GTI and an ext. warranty.

Originally Posted by Homeslice (Post 469879)

I agree, get a GTI. Best interior of anything on your list. And German cars own on the highway. Most Jap and American cars lose their composure when you try to make a quick lane change at high speed.

Fords & Mazda styling is only good for twenty-somethings. Aren't you older? They're kind of metrosexual anyway. The RX8 is nice, it has a true sportscar chassis, but it's kind of expensive and has absolutely horrible fuel economy. You'd be lucky to average 20 mpg.

The Genesis coupe is a disappointment. The V6 version is too heavy, and the turbo I4 version doesn't have the balance shafts that the new Sonata has.

Altima coupe is for chicks and metros who think the 2-door version is somehow better-looking than the 4-door, but sorry it's still not a sportscar. Sportscar = a car that does not share its chassis with a sedan.

370Z would actually be the best choice in terms of pure sportscar.........But as you stated, it's only a 2-seater.

Originally Posted by fujimoh (Post 469873)

You can into a lotus or ferrari for 30K

Originally Posted by Homeslice (Post 469879)

I agree, get a GTI. Best interior of anything on your list. And German cars own on the highway. Most Jap and American cars lose their composure when you try to make a quick lane change at high speed.

Fords & Mazda styling is only good for twenty-somethings. Aren't you older? They're kind of metrosexual anyway. The RX8 is nice, it has a true sportscar chassis, but it's kind of expensive and has absolutely horrible fuel economy. You'd be lucky to average 20 mpg.

The Genesis coupe is a disappointment. The V6 version is too heavy, and the turbo I4 version doesn't have the balance shafts that the new Sonata has.

Altima coupe is for chicks and metros who think the 2-door version is somehow better-looking than the 4-door, but sorry it's still not a sportscar. Sportscar = a car that does not share its chassis with a sedan.

370Z would actually be the best choice in terms of pure sportscar.........But as you stated, it's only a 2-seater.

Originally Posted by Gas Man (Post 469890)

I don't know about a 5 cylinder



Ok, sure I bought a HHRSS, it being where ever it is on the GM pecking list doesn't negate it's reliability or not.

A Caddy is a caddy. Nuff said and not in my playing field.

I agree that the Genesis and the Altima coupe being sisters. I looked at the Altima coupe today and it's simply not for me. It did nothing for me in the looks department. So much so that I never even drove it. Further as I said, I won't get the Hyaundi. Japan is one thing, Korean is another. I'll draw my line at Japan.

The Speed 3 is fine but still "not there". Which completes any Mazda from my consideration. Sorry Mazda.



I'm 32, Tuesday, but don't consider Ford or Mazda for 20 somin age.

100% correct on the RX8 chassis. It's awesome! Yes shit MPG, but so was most of what I was looking at.

As I said... Genesis is out entirely. I wouldn't be able to look at myself owning that. Altima... yeah I can agree with you on that.

I agree on the German cars. A buddy had a BMW years ago and loved it. 250hp was spanking 350hp mustangs. Beat the piss out of it for 3 years and it was as good after as it was new. I've always respected German cars and Hondas. Just weren't in my cup.

As I said I was going to the VW dealer today. They didn't have the GTI. I will need to go to a different dealer for that. However, I found the car for me... as long as I like the GTI.

The new 2012 Golf R. 50 more hp making it to 256hp, 6 speed manual (only offering YEA), and AWD. :dribble: 2 door or 4 door (2 door for me). Dealer is figuring it to price out around upper 20's, or maybe $30k fully loaded to the gills. It also offers all the great creature comforts and that beloved german interior of quality.

That's where I stand now. Going to try to get out this week to test drive a GTI. Then once my standing on my GM vehicle is one way or the other. Perhaps order or pre-order the Golf R. Who ever says anything bad about a Golf or GTI?

Originally Posted by Dave (Post 469912)

.....german cars blow dicks for reliability. most fun thing about em is trying to guess whats going to fall off next. ...

Originally Posted by 101lifts2 (Post 469917)

Eh...your living in the past. VW reliablity is almost as good as Toyota nowadays. 5 years ago..no...but in 2008 and higher..yes.

BMW makes the most reliable European car, but the MB engines are built to last longer. Transmissions are pretty much a wash. Germans give you consistently good build materials, Japan cheapens out every year.

The 2010 Golf I have walks any Japanese car in terms of material quality and solidity. They don't even come close...and the steering, chassis and braking are far better than any car in it's price range (I leased mine, but the price was 16,100). Not to mention the interior rocks and feels like its going to last 50 years. No issues yet, but its only a year old with 13k miles.

Originally Posted by Dave (Post 469841)

is that still the turbo 5 cylinder? might be worth waiting for. volvo c30 is basically the same thing though, thats a fun little car too, 5 bangers have this amazing intake wail

Originally Posted by Dave (Post 469912)

ferrari...no. not even close. you might get in the door on someone who is desperate with a 40 year old 308 but parts and service will eat you alive.

Originally Posted by Dave (Post 469919)

we had parts literally falling off the motors on our fleet bmws before they got binned. our audis have what could only be kindly referred to as an oil addiction and toyota makes some amazingly boneheaded designs. like for example the prius gas bladder and the fuel guess gauge. never drove one i actually liked

Originally Posted by fujimoh (Post 469873)

You can into a lotus or ferrari for 30K

Originally Posted by Dave (Post 469912)

balance shafts are for faggots

Originally Posted by derf (Post 469939)

You are talking about basically a rental fleet, people abuse those cars worse than anything else, I give your opinion no consideration whatsoever.

Originally Posted by 101lifts2 (Post 469872)

The Mazda 3 IMO has too underassisted steering. VW seems to be the best in terms of steering, braking and chassis. I'd say get a GTI and an ext. warranty.

Originally Posted by Dave (Post 469919)

we had parts literally falling off the motors on our fleet bmws before they got binned.....

Originally Posted by Particle Man (Post 469961)

I'm the opposite - I figure if a car can go through that it can go through anything I could possibly throw at it.

Originally Posted by derf (Post 469967)

incidently I was extremely scared to drive the last cobalt I rented, it made noises that I never would have expected to hear come out of a car.

Originally Posted by Homeslice (Post 469974)

lol...

One thing that's very common with GM FWD cars is a "hollow" noise when driving over bumps. Makes you think a control arm is about to fall off.

Originally Posted by Trip (Post 470011)

Fuck this talk about other cars, I want to know the story on the 180 degree spin towards GM.

Originally Posted by derf (Post 469967)

When was the last time you saw a rental car with more than 40 or 50k miles? Or more than a few years old? You dont because companies realize that as rentals the cars start costing more in maintenance at that point than they would be to replace with a newer model.....

Originally Posted by derf (Post 469980)

No, I mean that when I started it up there was a small clacking sound that got worse after 5 minutes. The clacking turned into a steady stream of metallic clanking sounds. The only way that I can really describe the sound is that it was like a thousand really tiny garden gnomes wearing steel condoms where anally raping the engine to the tune of old mcdonald. I wound up bringing the car back because I really thought that it would leave me on the side of the road. The car had less than 10k on it.

The hollow wurring suspension noise is normal for FWD GM.

Originally Posted by 101lifts2 (Post 469966)

What parts? Very very rare to see anything "fall off an engine" that is production intent.

Originally Posted by derf (Post 469967)

When was the last time you saw a rental car with more than 40 or 50k miles? Or more than a few years old? You dont because companies realize that as rentals the cars start costing more in maintenance at that point than they would be to replace with a newer model. It doesnt matter what kind of car it is dropping from N to D with the engine spinning at 6k will destroy it.

incidently I was extremely scared to drive the last cobalt I rented, it made noises that I never would have expected to hear come out of a car.

Originally Posted by Trip (Post 470011)

Fuck this talk about other cars, I want to know the story on the 180 degree spin towards GM.

Originally Posted by Trip (Post 470011)

Fuck this talk about other cars, I want to know the story on the 180 degree spin towards GM.

Originally Posted by Drewpy (Post 470027)

GM=the suck

Originally Posted by tallywacker (Post 470039)

Yep, Gas send us a copy of what went down to our PM boxes.

Originally Posted by OneSickPsycho (Post 470017)

That's the reason I keep clicking on this thread.

Originally Posted by OneSickPsycho (Post 470017)

That's the reason I keep clicking on this thread.

Originally Posted by smileyman (Post 470112)

Toyota should have the FT-86 out soon and the updated Subaru Impreza Coupe looks promising. Wait long enough and Mazda's RX8 replacement will show or get the Genesis, just wait till they sort out their manual transmission action. I hear it is lurchy between the clutch, shifter, and take up.

Maybe look at the updated Honda Civic Si if your front wheel drive friendly...

Originally Posted by derf (Post 470121)

Since he has not actually told us why the about face on GM lets just make shit up.

I bet he took his GM car for a drive and it caught fire and wouldnt stop moving while he was in it, so he crashed into a school bus full of kids and killed them all. So now he needs to move on to Toyotas which arent known for hitting school buses while on fire and accelerating out of control

Originally Posted by derf (Post 470121)

Since he has not actually told us why the about face on GM lets just make shit up.

I bet he took his GM car for a drive and it caught fire and wouldnt stop moving while he was in it, so he crashed into a school bus full of kids and killed them all. So now he needs to move on to Toyotas which arent known for hitting school buses while on fire and accelerating out of control

Originally Posted by Homeslice (Post 470136)

drewpy, derf, dave, dubbs, defector...i cant tell you guys apart

Originally Posted by defector (Post 470138)

I'm the short one.

Originally Posted by derf (Post 470140)

I'm the grumpy one

Originally Posted by derf (Post 470121)

Since he has not actually told us why the about face on GM lets just make shit up.

I bet he took his GM car for a drive and it caught fire and wouldnt stop moving while he was in it, so he crashed into a school bus full of kids and killed them all. So now he needs to move on to Toyotas which arent known for hitting school buses while on fire and accelerating out of control

Originally Posted by Dave (Post 470128)

Ill bet him and uma were in the backseat making babies when the onstar folks got caught evesdropping

Originally Posted by Gas Man (Post 470214)

Perhaps... is the Volvo better to my age (32) than the VW?? IDK

Originally Posted by tallywacker (Post 470215)

I like them because there aren't many S30's on the road. Unique car.

Originally Posted by Gas Man (Post 470214)

Perhaps... is the Volvo better to my age (32) than the VW?? IDK

Originally Posted by Dave (Post 470219)

Volvo is a solid ass car. Almost bought one. Oil pan is cast so try not to bang it on anything

Originally Posted by tallywacker (Post 470221)

whoops I mean c30

http://www.c30world.com/forums/

Find some insight on there and see if there is anything to avoid.

Originally Posted by anthonyk (Post 470235)

Normally I'd say yes, but these days it's a tough call. :lol

Originally Posted by Gas Man (Post 470214)

Perhaps... is the Volvo better to my age (32) than the VW?? IDK

Originally Posted by Homeslice (Post 470251)

Both are fine up to age 50. They have that Euro maturity.

The Mazdaspeed though, eh.......35 tops

Originally Posted by Homeslice (Post 470251)

Both are fine up to age 50. They have that Euro maturity.

The Mazdaspeed though, eh.......35 tops

Originally Posted by Gas Man (Post 470202)

Combine the 2 and you have it.

Just saw a Volvo today. Priced out a sweet C30R at $32k on their website.

Originally Posted by 101lifts2 (Post 470257)

The GTI is a better car...but let's face it; you're gonna drive it like a pussy anyway, so might as well get the Volvo....Though the Volvo is kinda of a chick car.

:angel:

Originally Posted by Adeptus_Minor (Post 470265)

If you absolutely have to pay $32k for your Mazdaspeed 3, sure. :shrug:
I looked at both, I drove both, I bought the Mazda.

Originally Posted by Homeslice (Post 470280)

Get the one with a limited slip that actually works.........some don't

Originally Posted by Gas Man (Post 470465)

Are you saying they are built on the same platform? :skep:

Originally Posted by Gas Man (Post 470465)

Explain please.

Originally Posted by derf (Post 470478)

They are all using the ford C1 platform, so the answer is yes, but yes there are multiple engines that are swapped in the different vehicles

ford focus & fusion, mazda 3 & 5, volvo c30 &70 & V50 & S40

Originally Posted by Homeslice (Post 470519)

LSD's (limited slip differentials) are supposed to help tame torque steer on a powerful FWD car, as well as help it power out of tight corners. But many of them work poorly. The car boards and magazines would know.

I don't even know if some of those models have them. I believe the Mazdaspeed does.

Originally Posted by Homeslice (Post 470519)

I don't even know if some of those models have them. I believe the Mazdaspeed does.

Originally Posted by Adeptus_Minor (Post 470531)

The Mazdaspeed does use a limited slip differential and they also have a proprietary torque management system that helps cut down on wheel spin and torque steer by restricting torque output from the engine while steering.
Don't ask me how that works, Mazda doesn't go into great detail about it either.

Originally Posted by Gas Man (Post 470529)

Good to know.

But stating the similarity would be like saying a MKZ & Fusion are exactly alike and they just charge $10k more for the MKZ. They share the same platform but even the motors are different.

Originally Posted by Cutty72 (Post 470556)

Power/torque is limited in the first 3 gears as well.

Originally Posted by derf (Post 470560)

They share something like 50 or 60% of their parts. It the stuff you dont see that makes them the same, the unibody chassis is almost teh same, steering column, suspension, brakes, switches, electric motors, AC system, heater locks, wire harness, fuel tank, pumps etc... All the hidden shit you dont see. So when you pay 30k for a C30 volvo (still an awesome car) all you are really paying for is the cool body shape, motor and interior.