Strict Abortion Measures Enacted in Oklahoma

[the chi]

Originally Posted by Homeslice

Nice try on what? I never advocated any limits on women's rights.

I was only making a statement about how women are allowed to "get away" with many things just because they're the fairer sex. For example, Zsa Zsa Gabor slaps a police officer and doesn't get shit.....What would happen if a man did that? Or, a woman launches a tirade against their boss or against a customer, but isn't fired. What would happen to a man who did that? "Well she's a woman, and women are emotional" is the usual excuse......I've seen it all the time.

Or all the new drunk driving and sexual predator laws, where a woman who lost a child petitions to get a new law passed, and everyone votes yes, not necessarily because they think the law's great, but because they're afraid of the backlash from society (or their voters) if they argue against a grieving woman.

Or how courts are more likely to award custody to mothers...........Things might have changed, but it still seems like that's true.

Bad examples. They didnt get away with that because they are women, they got away with it because they are celebrities.

As far as the women going on tirades, where is a good example? Any person I know who has acted unprofessionally like that was fired, regardless off sex.

As far as the other items, thats politics, and has nothing to do with sex. It could be a grieving father or mother that "assists" a politician in allowing a law to get passed. I cant recall specific cases and while the females do typically outweigh the males on that matter, I can think of a couple of cases where a grieving father was the one who got laws passed. Not because of sex but because of whatever crime was committed.

Originally Posted by CrazyKell

Very well said.

The "callous whore" statement places such judgment and disdain on everything and really leaves a bad taste in my mouth.

Not only that but the whole "what a woman goes through" argument or point of view, is not necessarily supported by actual experiences. Everyone assumes that women are basically traumatized by an abortion. It's just not like that for everyone, and there's been a lot of research to show that it's a myth. Sure some might go through it, but for most it was a well thought out choice that was the right decision for them and they have absolutely no regrets about that. And it doesn't make them a callous whore.

Definitions of callous on the Web:

emotionally hardened; "a callous indifference to suffering"; "cold-blooded and indurate to public opinion"
make insensitive or callous; deaden feelings or morals

callously - in a callous way; "he callously exploited their feelings"

callosity - unfeelingness: devoid of passion or feeling; hardheartedness

callousness - The quality of being callous; emotional hardheartedness or indifference

Why would you find that judging? Was it aimed at you? Does it strike some cord within you makes you think it was? Try not taking things personally. Nowhere did it say "I think Kel or someone she knows is a callous whore".

Your argument is invalid btw. If even one person is scarred or emotionally damaged from an abortion, its not a myth.

Now boys and girls, lets see it used in a sentence. Or several.

If someone doesnt at least feel something after having an abortion I would definitely call them callous. Whether they are scarred or not depends on the person, but having to end a life, whether its because of a flaw in mother or baby, it being life threatening to the mother or simply because its not something the parents can do, it is still a very hard and serious decision and if someone doesnt give that thought or think about it in the years to come, I would stand by by statement that they are callous. No matter how you look at it, its still the taking of a life whether its necessary or not.

As far as the callous whore statement, if you read what I was stating, it refers to those women are stupid as we already discussed. The ones who go out, make bad decisions, sleep with a guy, get pregnant and have an abortion because its the easier way of dealing with it because they were too stupid, lazy and yes CALLOUS to use protection which would have negated the need to abort in the first place.

I grew up with girls whose only method of BC was going to the abortion doctor and getting rid of an unwanted pregnancy when they could have avoided it. Public health clinics, free condoms, ANYTHING would have at least made steps toward preventing. In other words, they "callously" disregarded the fetuses life (whether the fetus has a right to life is a whole different argument) and they often disregard the feelings of those involved, often the father of the fetus as Trip loves to argue.

I know women today who have had them done for their necessary reasons.

(No persons reason will be exactly the same and what one person feels is necessary may not be something you agree with, but its not your decision on what is reasonable for another person, and trying to judge another or make that decision for them like these laws are trying to do is not yours or the govts right.)

The stupid irresponsible girls and women who used it as birth control never gave a thought to anything other than themselves, which lends weight to Trips argument about the guys not having a choice. The women who had to make the decision for something other than stupidity and selfishness never forget what they had to do or how it made them feel i.e. it was not made "callously".

[Trip]

Originally Posted by Kaneman

Sure, you can "get" a flacid penis into a very lubricated coochiecoo...maybe. But you can't force an erection and you can't force a pregnancy.

I mistook it for a man couldn't get raped, yeah it would be really hard to rape and man and get yourself pregnant. You would need a lot of time and help.

Originally Posted by The Chi

The stupid irresponsible girls and women who used it as birth control never gave a thought to anything other than themselves, which lends weight to Trips argument about the guys not having a choice. The women who had to make the decision for something other than stupidity and selfishness never forget what they had to do or how it made them feel i.e. it was not made "callously".

These are the same girls it would impact by allowing the douches to run off. Honestly, we don't need more welfare babies, letting the douchebags run off and leaving the girls responsible would hopefully result in more abortions of more potentially worthless individuals.

[the chi]

Originally Posted by Trip

These are the same girls it would impact by allowing the douches to run off. Honestly, we don't need more welfare babies, letting the douchebags run off and leaving the girls responsible would hopefully result in more abortions of more potentially worthless individuals.

I cant for the life of me figure out what your last couple of posts are talking about...

I think it depends primarily on how you view abortion tho. Some folks view it as murder, some (the ones in the using is as BC method) dont, but still, having needless abortions is kinda why the anti abortion movement is so gung ho and receives so much support. I vote for sterilization of stupids. Male and female.

Editted to add: as decided by a well rounded group of their peers for fairness sake.

[Trip]

Originally Posted by The Chi

I cant for the life of me figure out what your last couple of posts are talking about...

I think it depends primarily on how you view abortion tho. Some folks view it as murder, some (the ones in the using is as BC method) dont, but still, having needless abortions is kinda why the anti abortion movement is so gung ho and receives so much support. I vote for sterilization of stupids. Male and female.

Editted to add: as decided by a well rounded group of their peers for fairness sake.

It's pretty easy, it's about being pro choice and using abortion as a viable birth control option.

Who cares what the anti abortionists think, if you are pro choice you are pro choice.

It sounds to me like you haven't actually decided if you are pro choice or pro life yet. Which is it, a viable birth control option or a destructive practice? You seem to be stuck in the middle.

[Kaneman]

Originally Posted by Trip

I mistook it for a man couldn't get raped, yeah it would be really hard to rape and man and get yourself pregnant. You would need a lot of time and help.

Maybe if you drugged him....though Viagra and the like still require sexual stimulation. I've heard porn-stars inject steroids into their John Thomas'....maybe that'd do the trick. I believe two girls one cup proved that you can orgasm while being disgusted.

[CrazyKell]

Originally Posted by The Chi

Bad examples. They didnt get away with that because they are women, they got away with it because they are celebrities.

As far as the women going on tirades, where is a good example? Any person I know who has acted unprofessionally like that was fired, regardless off sex.

As far as the other items, thats politics, and has nothing to do with sex. It could be a grieving father or mother that "assists" a politician in allowing a law to get passed. I cant recall specific cases and while the females do typically outweigh the males on that matter, I can think of a couple of cases where a grieving father was the one who got laws passed. Not because of sex but because of whatever crime was committed.



Definitions of callous on the Web:

emotionally hardened; "a callous indifference to suffering"; "cold-blooded and indurate to public opinion"
make insensitive or callous; deaden feelings or morals

callously - in a callous way; "he callously exploited their feelings"

callosity - unfeelingness: devoid of passion or feeling; hardheartedness

callousness - The quality of being callous; emotional hardheartedness or indifference

Why would you find that judging? Was it aimed at you? Does it strike some cord within you makes you think it was? Try not taking things personally. Nowhere did it say "I think Kel or someone she knows is a callous whore".

Your argument is invalid btw. If even one person is scarred or emotionally damaged from an abortion, its not a myth.

Now boys and girls, lets see it used in a sentence. Or several.

If someone doesnt at least feel something after having an abortion I would definitely call them callous. Whether they are scarred or not depends on the person, but having to end a life, whether its because of a flaw in mother or baby, it being life threatening to the mother or simply because its not something the parents can do, it is still a very hard and serious decision and if someone doesnt give that thought or think about it in the years to come, I would stand by by statement that they are callous. No matter how you look at it, its still the taking of a life whether its necessary or not.

As far as the callous whore statement, if you read what I was stating, it refers to those women are stupid as we already discussed. The ones who go out, make bad decisions, sleep with a guy, get pregnant and have an abortion because its the easier way of dealing with it because they were too stupid, lazy and yes CALLOUS to use protection which would have negated the need to abort in the first place.

I grew up with girls whose only method of BC was going to the abortion doctor and getting rid of an unwanted pregnancy when they could have avoided it. Public health clinics, free condoms, ANYTHING would have at least made steps toward preventing. In other words, they "callously" disregarded the fetuses life (whether the fetus has a right to life is a whole different argument) and they often disregard the feelings of those involved, often the father of the fetus as Trip loves to argue.

I know women today who have had them done for their necessary reasons.

(No persons reason will be exactly the same and what one person feels is necessary may not be something you agree with, but its not your decision on what is reasonable for another person, and trying to judge another or make that decision for them like these laws are trying to do is not yours or the govts right.)

The stupid irresponsible girls and women who used it as birth control never gave a thought to anything other than themselves, which lends weight to Trips argument about the guys not having a choice. The women who had to make the decision for something other than stupidity and selfishness never forget what they had to do or how it made them feel i.e. it was not made "callously".

I'm not taking it personally nor did it strike a chord. But you weren't saying 'callous' (which I would have agreed with given your definitions), you were saying "callous whore" which implies a whole lot of judgment.

As a society, we can't say that you can do something, and then say "oh only for certain reasons." We either allow it or we don't. Nose jobs are for the most part stupid and unneccessary (as is a lot of plastic surgery), but people are allowed to get it and no one has any say in WHY they get them. In no way am I equating a nose job with an abortion, but if we allow something....we allow it. Simple as. We can't say "oh you can only get a nose job if you were punched by your boyfriend."

And as for the "myth" part. Of course it's a decision and is weighed by anyone who's ever done it. And of course they feel something. But there is this view put out there that every woman who has an abortion regrets it for the rest of her life and is never the same and....blah blah blah. It's just not like that for everyone or even half as many as they would have you believe.

For a very good portion it was a choice they made. The RIGHT choice for them. No regrets. No spending years wondering "what if". None of that. Just done and move on. Doesn't make them callous or a whore.

[azoomm]

Originally Posted by CrazyKell

And as for the "myth" part. Of course it's a decision and is weighed by anyone who's ever done it. And of course they feel something. But there is this view put out there that every woman who has an abortion regrets it for the rest of her life and is never the same and....blah blah blah. It's just not like that for everyone or even half as many as they would have you believe.

For a very good portion it was a choice they made. The RIGHT choice for them. No regrets. No spending years wondering "what if". None of that. Just done and move on. Doesn't make them callous or a whore.

I'm sorry, what?

I made the decision. I don't regret it. But, I am most certainly haunted by it. It was the absolute right decision, there is no doubt in my mind. BUT, I remember it like it was yesterday. The same goes for each woman I have talked to that has been through it.

It isn't as though I would break down in tears over it when it's brought up. But, it's something I went through that was VERY traumatic. Both physically [I distinctly remember being told to not scream], and emotionally [cried for a week].

Anyone that tells you they simply moved on is not telling you the whole truth.

[CrazyKell]

Originally Posted by azoomm

I'm sorry, what?

I made the decision. I don't regret it. But, I am most certainly haunted by it. It was the absolute right decision, there is no doubt in my mind. BUT, I remember it like it was yesterday. The same goes for each woman I have talked to that has been through it.

It isn't as though I would break down in tears over it when it's brought up. But, it's something I went through that was VERY traumatic. Both physically [I distinctly remember being told to not scream], and emotionally [cried for a week].

Anyone that tells you they simply moved on is not telling you the whole truth.

I'm not saying it's not traumatic for some women, or something that will haunt them. That wasn't my point.

My point was that the popular view put out there is that it's traumatic for every woman and every woman will regret it. It just isn't the case.

[azoomm]

Originally Posted by CrazyKell

I'm not saying it's not traumatic for some women, or something that will haunt them. That wasn't my point.

My point was that the popular view put out there is that it's traumatic for every woman and every woman will regret it. It just isn't the case.

True 'nuff

[Amber Lamps]

Originally Posted by CrazyKell

I'm not saying it's not traumatic for some women, or something that will haunt them. That wasn't my point.

My point was that the popular view put out there is that it's traumatic for every woman and every woman will regret it. It just isn't the case.

I don't understand why you are discussing this in the third person... Do you regret having an abortion or have you moved on?

I had a GF in high school that went off and had an abortion behind my back, it tainted all later relationships. At the time I was a VERY devote Catholic and had to be TALKED into having sex in the first place (true story). Her father was a MISSIONARY, go figure, and her Aunt snuck her off to do the deed. I never forgave her and have thought about that child on the occasions when I see other people with children. It honestly helped convince me to get fixed at the ripe old age of 24... I never want to allow someone else the ability to choose whether or not my child gets to live. NEVER.

On the other hand, I really couldn't care less how many other children are aborted as long as I don't have to pay for it. I understand that I'm paying for welfare but I guess that I'd rather pay for them to live than pay for them to die....

Anyway, I don't agree that women that were raped should have to put up with any more trauma, although I understand that if rape victims were let off the hook, wouldn't all abortion candidates claim rape? I guess they would have to prove it or have a case out or something.... I despise rapists, molester, etc and think they should be castrated!